My friends, I would like to start this post with expressing my support and sympathy to the Greatest Football Player Ever, Johan Cruyff. The Catalan Salvador announced that he is battling lung cancer at the moment. Johan was a chainsmoker most of his active life and quit in 1991 after serious heart problems. Johan is a fighter and will do what he can to win this match as well, I’m sure. Still, our thoughts are with him and his family….

Johan Cruyff smoking on the touchline - 06 Dec 2006

Historically, we have had numerous amazing quotes from famous people that were so completely wrong, it isn’t funny anymore.

In 1962, some Decca head honcho didn’t sign The Beatles. “Guitar bands are out. The Beatles have no future in music.”

Some banker in 1903: “The horse is here to say. The automobile is a fad. Don’t invest in Ford Motors.”

Variety magazine in 1955 on Rock & Roll: “It will be gone by June.”

Politician in England, 1969: “Never will we see a female PM in England!” (Margaret Thatcher, anyone?)

Microsoft CEO Steve Balmer in 2007: “The iPhone will not succeed. They will not get marketshare.”

William Orton of Western Union at Bell’s presentation of the phone, in 1876: “This telephone has too many shortcomings to be ever considered a serious means of communications.”

Now we can add: “This qualification group for Euro 2016: it will be harder for Oranje to not qualify, than it is to qualify…”

oranje fans balen

So let’s analyse…

1. Inheritance of Louis van Gaal

I think Louis is partly to blame. Halfway through the qualifications for Brazil he already said he didn’t like the job and basically only did it for his own ego and resume. He would only do the job for 2 years and when Oranje was done in Brazil he ran to the exit, which took him to Man United. He never did any knowledge transfer, neither has he taken the responsibility to hand over the team. Any team that worked and played under Van Gaal has been forced into a straight jacket. Any successor to Van Gaal will find a team that is used to being told exactly what to do. His club teams usually consist of mature players already fed up with him when he leaves (Barca, Bayern, Ajax) but this Dutch national team owed a lot to Van Gaal and his way of working. De Vrij, Blind, Depay and BMI all made lucrative transfers thanks to LVG. Some players will have had a breath of fresh air when he left (Robben, Sneijder, De Jong) others were probably a bit at a loss without Louis (BMI, De Vrij, Depay).

blind verliest

2. Installing Guus Hiddink as LVG successor

Bert van Oostveen is responsible for this decision. It would have been perfectly acceptable to pick a coach to follow up Louis van Gaal who understands the Van Gaal vision and can work on that basis. Co Adriaanse was an option. Danny Blind would have been a good pick as well. Unknown Joachim Low took over from Klinsmann after 2006 for Germany, in the same vein Blind could have taken the baton from Louis. But no, the KNVB selected the one and only Dutch coach who is totally opposite of Van Gaal. Van Gaal is in your face, intense, tactically disciplined and driven… Hiddink is arms length. Loose, not really strong tactically, “come on boys, enjoy!” kind of coach. No wonder Blind and Hiddink couldn’t see eye to eye. On top of that, Hiddink lost his swagger a bit. He became soft and a doubter.One match, Nigel de Jong was the “captain in midfield”, the next game Nigel wasn’t selected… The worst decision, picking Hiddink. Too big a change for a young and not so incredibly talented squad. What Louis did in Brazil worked, but somehow the KNVB wanted to break the trend…

oranje qual

3. Instructing Hiddink to play “Total Football”

The biggest joke. Total Football. What is it exactly? Bert van Oostveen doesn’t know… Is it playing a right footed player on the left wing? Probably not. Is it playing square balls in defence at a slow pace? Probably not. Van Oostveen describes it as “attractive”, “dominant”, “attacking” and “using wingers”. And it is being translated as “4-3-3”. Hellooooooo… If that is Total Football or Dutch School, it appears that many nations play this. And probably not because of some egotistical “Dutch School” brand, but because they 1) have the players to do so and 2) because all the other terms are subjective… The only time Holland won anything was playing 4-4-2. We tend to forget we had a lot of luck against the Irish, against the English (off side goal Van Basten), against West Germany (our penalty was not a penalty) and against the USSR in the finals (the first 25 minutes were for the USSR). It is being sold as if Total Football in 1974 was the result of strategy. It wasn’t. The center backs were picked by chance due to tremendous injuries (Hulshoff, Israel, Laseroms, Drost and Mansveld were all out) and we happen to have two amazing world class players in Cruyff and Van Hanegem. Oh, and in case you forgot: we played Total Football but we lost the finals… Playing 4-3-3 when you don’t have the players is silly and suicidal. Playing 4-3-3 for the hell of it with a right footer on the left and a left footer on the right is different from the 4-3-3 we played in 1974. Which may have been 4-3-3 on paper but one Johan Cruyff was always everywhere on the pitch, except for the center striker position. Van Gaal picked 5-3-2 for a reason. Finishing third at the World Cup did not change the reasons why he went for 5-3-2.

ANP-Oranjefans_0

4. Overestimating our qualities

We beat Spain at the World Cup, but not because of our great play, but because they let themselves down. Re-watch the first half. They were cutting through our defence like a hot knife through butter. We got lucky with that super goal by Robin van Persie. Spain only has one game plan, so they kept attacking and we kept counter attacking. Australia deserved to win against us. The Chile game was less relevant and Mexico was hard done by. A close game, if there ever was one. Costa Rica simply lacked quality but held us at 0-0. Argentina tried hard but didn’t succeed. And Oranje was putting it all towards Robben who couldn’t find the gap between Argentina. Obviously, by then, Brazil was already in severe depression and it wasn’t hard for Oranje to rob it in, nicely. But it didn’t mean a thing. But we came back with Bronze. We silenced all criticasters. Some of us went to play for big EPL or Seria A or Portugal Liga clubs. And we were the Kings of Europe (Germany was the Emperor).

spelers balen

5. Frail Foundation of Players

After finishing third it can’t be helped that players (and staff, and fans, and media) believe we are really something. The start of the campaign – seen as an easy one – was devoid of real desire. It took two games or so for people to slowly “wake up”. In the meantime, trouble had hit the squad, in the form of injuries and form issues (Vlaar, Van Persie, Robben, Janmaat). We suddenly realised that without the 5-3-2 and without some players in top form (Vlaar, De Vrij and Robben in particular were outstanding in Brazil), we are not that great. During the qualifications, we lost a number of important players to injuries, and the frail foundation of Dutch talent came to light when others didn’t get the playing time we hoped (BMI, Huntelaar, Van Persie). The tremendous gap between 30+ year old top class players (Sneijder, Robben, Huntelaar, De Jong, Van Persie, Van der Vaart) and the potential top class players of around 20 years (Depay, Rekik, Willems, Klaassen, Berghuis, Veltman, Van Beek) wasn’t filled with leading players in the age-group 24-28… Daley Blind, Georginhio Wijnaldum and Darryl Janmaat are probably the only ones fit (Strootman being the only real top class midfielder, and his return to that level is questionable) and they are probably nothing more than good team players, nothing more, nothing less.

RVP zit

6. Defensive qualities

LVG noticed it in his qualification campaign. The Dutch don’t have strong defenders. The problems started already in 2008. Ooijer, Mathijsen, Heitinga…they were criticised from the off and a lot of people never expected Holland to do well in the WC2010 with those defenders. Van Marwijk needed Van Bronckhorst as left back and replaced him with 18 year old Jetro Willems for the Euro2012. We used to develop good ones. From Krol and Israel and Laseroms, to Spelbos, Van Tiggelen,Wijnstekers to Jaap Stam, Michael Reiziger and John de Wolf but around 2004 the qualities started to fade. We do develop them. In spades actually. Bruma, Vlaar, Rekik, Veltman, Denswil, De Vrij, Martins Indi, Gouweleeuw, Viergever, Kongolo, Van Dijk, Van der Hoorn, Van Beek…. but none of them (maybe Van Beek) has the ruthlessness and commitment we see in Italian and English defenders. Is it lack of defensive DNA? No, it is not. It is lack of development.

hunter buik

7.  Lack of desire

It is a given that mental strenght, focus and desire can add a significant level of quality to any team. The Greek national team in 2004, the Germans in 1996, Atletico Madrid, Leicester City, Liverpool 2005… There are so many examples. Barca and Bayern have it. Last season, Chelsea had it. Oranje had it in 2010. It was mistaken for “ugly football”. You have to really really want it. Today, in modern football, football skills is not enough. Barcelona demonstrates the work ethics and discipline needed to really rise up. Our Oranje doesn’t have the football skill and finesse of Spain. If we do not match the desire of the opponent (yes, Iceland away, Czechs at home, Turkey away), our lack of quality means we will lose the game. It is again, something that needs to be added in the development of teams and talent. It’s youth development, but also scouting and selecting. Over the last years, Holland developed lots of tantalizing talents, who can play football, but don’t seem to have the desire, the iron will to succeed. Adam Maher, Royston Drenthe, Ryan Babel, Ricardo Kishna, Ibi Afellay, JP Boetius, Eljero Elia….

Wesley Sneijder said something telling, only a week ago. When a reporter asked an innocent question about Playstations, Wes said something profound. “In my time, when I came to Oranje, the older players played cards. As young players you were taken in to the game and you created a bond. Today, players come to the hotel with their PS4 and go to their rooms to play FIFA. A bit childish, I think. You won’t see me doing that.”

Oostveen czech

Who is responsible?

Obviously, the man who appoints the coach and the man who instructs the coach is end responsible. Going from LVG to Hiddink was a big mistake that someone with football expertise would have spotted. The decision to go back to “4-3-3” or Total Football was pedantic. A proud Dutch national team wanting to show the world that the rest of the world is doing it wrong. On what basis? Van Oostveen needs to be replaced by a more football savvie experienced CEO. Gaston Sporre (ex PEC Zwolle and ex Heerenveen) is an outstanding candidate. As would Ruud van Duyvenbode (former Ajax and Feyenoord defender and long time Ajax board member). Or Toon Gerbrands, former AZ Alkmaar and current PSV general manager.

toon lou

Toon Gerbrands and Louis van Gaal

For talent development and overall KNVB football strategy, the KNVB need to appoint a Technical Director. Someone with extensive development and football management experience. Wim Jansen might be too old, but someone like Co Adriaanse would do. Foppe de Haan comes to mind. Martin Jol, maybe? Once the KNVB establishes the direction to take, the coach can be appointed…

I personally believe Danny Blind is a good man for the job. I don’t buy the “he lacks experience” rhetoric. Blind was captain of the best Ajax of the last 40 years and has worked in football in every role thinkable, incl head coach of Ajax and assistant to Van Gaal at Oranje. Joachim Low of Germany and Prandelli of Italy did not have big coaching jobs prior to their national coaching jobs. A national team manager coach is a totally different role than club coach. As Louis van Gaal blatantly put it. “I hate this job.”

Blind is a good builder, I think. Great with young players, a good and steady personality, strong communication skills and an eye for talent.

jan and jc

The two iconic Dutch football legends: your humble blogger and JC

Development

In terms of development, the Dutch have always focused almost exclusively on ball skills. If you control the ball, you control the game, was a motto often heard. But these days, the game has changed. Every player on top level now has excellent ball skills. A workhorse midfielder these days can play like the best of them. Polyvalent players is the term. The Strootmans, the Pogbas, the Busquets, the Pastores and Modrices of this world can do it all. Score, assist, tackle, pass, run… Physical improvements have been made. Tactical improvements have been made. By all nations. The Dutch don’t lead on skill or tactics anymore. What will be a key differentiator, as said before, is the will to win. The ability to focus fully. These are elements that need to be brought into the development program. Venom on the ball and off the ball. The intensity that we see in C Ronaldo, Messi, Thomas Muller, Lampard, Eden Hazard and Yohan Cabaye. Furthermore, we need to focus more on playing without the ball. The Dutch grow up wanting the ball and when we do, we are not bad. But once we lose the ball, we are horrific and all over the place.

varkenoord

Young talents at Varkenoord (Feyenoord)

We have been forcussing too much on playing with the ball. The youth teams of Ajax, Feyenoord, AZ, Vitesse, Sparta, NEC…they know how to win their games in the Dutch leagues. But as soon as the Bazoers, the Berguizen, the Klaassens and Vilhenas are confronted with international opponents (for instance in Europa League games, in CL qualification games or Euro or World Cup tournaments for rep teams), eventually they “run into the knife” as the expression goes.

Financial Fair Play

The situation at European / Global level has impacted football life in smaller countries. The Bosman ruling is another aspect. As long as Dutch clubs get a fraction of the tv income that other nations get (England, Spain, Germany) it will be hard for Dutch clubs to compete on quality. On top of that, in Spain and England, clubs can have negative equity on the balance sheet. Whereas Dutch (and German clubs) have to balance the books. This means that Ajax – Real Madrid is per definition not a game played on an even playing field. If the UEFA really aims to produce a “fair and equitable” European competition they should make sure the rules are the same pan European.

uefa money

Johan Cruyff made a strong case, not just for Holland but also for Spain, England and other national teams to have a rule that forces clubs to field at least six homegrown players (as in: born and raised in the home country). This will put countries with strong development cultures on a more even keel. It will force countries with an overflow of import players (England!) to develop more “own” players and as a result strengthen their national teams.

High horse

Clubs, like the KNVB, will need to get off their high horse. Ajax in particular. They have the so-called Ajax house style. That house style is still held as sacred although it has been forfeited years ago. But no one wants to admit it. The Ajax style is: fast ball circulation, pass and move, wingers (Keizer, Swart, Ling, Van ‘t Schip, Roy, Overmars), a number 10 behind the striker (Bergkamp, Bosman, Litmanen) and a libero (Vasovic, Krol, Blind, De Boer)  who moves up to midfield whenever possible.

That is not how Ajax plays today. Co Adriaanse was sacked for abandoning the “Ajax style” but every coach after him has done the exact same thing.

ajax tactics

The Ajax Housestyle

Ajax (and the others) need to determine what their identity is. Do they want to dazzle and impress (which they fail to do in Europe)? Do they want to showcase great players and sell them with a fat profit (which they do)? Or do they want silverware? Because the way Ronald Koeman played with Feyenoord and copied by LVG for the WC2014, I am talking a fortified defence to deal with stronger opposition, might well be the only way for the weaker Dutch clubs to present themselves in Europe.

Lots of work to be done.

And it should be led by the KNVB. With a clear strategy for football identity and development. We need to stop allowing a lawyer to determine that. We need wise men to come together. We need to get a development strategy to support the clubs and we need to learn to use systems in our teams that are based on the player material we have.

In my view, we need to go back to 5-3-2. It worked. And with reason.

We have weak and inexperienced defenders, so we need some more bodies back there. We have good players for the flanks, good passers in midfield and some exceptional talents upfront.

151019-hateboer

Co Adriaanse suggests 5-3-2 with Groningen right back Hatenboer

No problem with goalies. I’m a Krul fan, but Cillesen, Stekelenburg, Vorm and Vermeer can do the job too. Zoet for me is too unproven.

At the back, I like De Vrij – Blind – Van Dijk. Bruma, Rekik, Van Beek, Veltman are candidates as well, as  will be Ron Vlaar and Martins Indi, if they show their strength.

Wide on the left, Willems is key. But Pieters, van Aanholt, Kongolo and Riedewald normally should be able to manage as well.

Wide on the right, Janmaat is my man. But a Van der Wiel with rhythm or a Tete or Bacuna can play there too.

The three man midfield needs either Sneijder or Clasie. Great passers of the game. I’d use players like Wijnaldum, Strootman, Fer, Klaassen or Van Ginkel as the other two midfielder. Some length, some legs/lungs and some power is good to have. Upfront, I’d use Robben always, and pair him up with the man in form. Could be Van Persie. Or Memphis. Or Promes. Or El Ghazi. Or Berghuis. Or Sneijder even… (with Clasie behind him in midfield).

 

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169 responses to “Dutch football needs make over. Fast!”

  1. AZ-forever says:

    Thank you for the post, Jan. It is not only in the football, it is everywhere when you appoint wrong person to an executive position, everything will get wrong. I work for a big corporation in US and for the past 10 years, all managerial positions were handled to either stupid women (to increase gender diversity) or to ambitious smoothly talking men who were not experts of the field. The results: for the past five years no new products have been launched, many brilliant foreign experts were either laid off or left the company…

    Have you watched this week European Cup games…I think it was another indicator how weak Dutch clubs are. AZ dominated entire game had plenty of chances against Augsburg but was unable to score a single goal. We call V. Jansen a promising talent. He is a main forward of AZ and he scored only 3 goals within 10 matches in Eredivisie and missed almost 54 opportunities (I count it every game). Look at the efficiency…And this is our promising talent!!!!???? PSV was able to withstand to Wolfsburg only 45 minutes. I can not get tired of being surprised how stupid Bruma is…..And those “farting dolls” from Ajax?…Do not want even to talk about them…At least Groningen earned 0.16 points for the Netherlands in the UEFA coefficient table. It looks like in 2017-2018 season, Eredivisie Champion will start in CL from the second round of qualification….

  2. KJ says:

    Cruyff will beat it with a Cruyff turn.

  3. Steve M says:

    Brilliant
    Thanks Jan

  4. Steve M says:

    Coming up Saturday:

    -England
    AVilla v Swansea, will Bacuna or Eder play?
    Stoke v Watford, let’s see if Pieters and Ake keep their spots, would love to see more minutes for van Ginkel, Afelaay and Berghuis as well, but they seem to all be used as subs…
    In the Championship, hopefully Chery and Fer continue to play well for QPR.

    -Spain
    Betis, van Wolfswinkel and maybe Vaart (if fit) will likely be on the bench as usual)

    -Germany
    Robben has been declared fit to play v Cologne, will probably be on the bench..
    Hopefully we see something good from Castaignos and Dost, Dost probably being the ‘in form’ Dutch striker at the moment.

    -Eredivisie
    Would like to check out PSV away to struggling Twente, if I can find a decent stream (tough to watch Dutch league in Canada…).

  5. bitterballen says:

    Wishing cruyff a speedy recovery .

    How come no one talks about Wesley hoedt or Maarten de roon? They have been playing for lazio and atalanta respectively week in and week out and quite well too !

    • Jan says:

      I can’t really follow ITalian football. I struggle already as it is :-). But feel free to share more. I like you guys being roving reporters for the blog!

    • bobotoh says:

      I only watch him (Hoedt) on youtube. I think he is very good as central defender. Not only that, he is at Lazio, which also play in the Europe League.

      If Holland wants to play with 3 central defenders at the back, he should be one one of them (Hoedt, Van Dijk, and De Vrij).

    • Steve M says:

      I don’t watch Atalanta play but I’ve been trying to catch Lazio – both wilson turned me on to.
      Hoedt was great v Rosenborg Thursday, hit the post with a header early. Mauricio his CB partner got a red card after 5 mins and they still won 3-1.
      Still young and makes a few errors but he will be good. Probably only starting because of injury troubles at Lazio.
      Check him out Sunday, maybe Kishna will play too.
      I heard de Vrij had a set back and is 6 weeks off yet…too bad, but nice little Dutch contingent at Lazio though!

      Love bobotohs idea of de Vrij, van Dijk and Hoedt together, in theory

      • wilson says:

        On another note Stefano Dens Wil made his injury return for Club Brugge in Europe league vs Legia Warszawa. He is also a great defender but I doubt he will be given the nod if he stays at Brugge.

        also Joost Van Aken is almost ready to make a back for Hereenveen after spending some time on the sidelines. He is also a promising defender.

  6. TIJU1234 says:

    there is lack of desire to an extend..but the real problem is back passing mentality and side passing mentality,as cruyff said holland has become world champiuon of this…we struggled to creta echances in our first 8 matches,then we played 2 gamble games..
    I think we lack serious quality drop in wings,we have got zero WINGERS IMO…As long as our wing play doesnt get strong i dont see orange winning against a competitive team in a competitive match…..Some players need s to dropped for ever..RVP was playing real slow and lsuggish for Fener vs ajax..so much of offside to compensate his lack of speed thus kill all the chances for his own team.
    Depay is one of the worst player in Manu starting 11.
    Grace of LVg is getting in to saturation.
    Hunter is inconistsant in schalke.
    Nijel—is not getting younger
    Roben—-Has to reddeem his fitness will he??/answer seems no.
    Snijder—Only one fit and eligble old player to play NT.
    Vrijil –has his own flaws as defender,i feel Reikik is better than him.Still cannot forget how martial schoooled him even Southampton were a better team in that match.
    Bruma—Lacks concentration
    Annholt——–Luuk———Wijnaldum
    ————–Sneijder————–
    ——-Hendrix——-Vanginkel——–
    Williams—Reikik—Devrij—-Tete
    ———–Cillssen/krul/vorm/vermeer——–
    Lenz———-Dost———–Vanrhijn–
    ————Maher——————
    ——-Blind—–Bazoer———–
    Mitchell—Kongolo–Vanbeek—–Hateboer
    ———–Cillssen/krul/vorm/vermeer——–
    With hoping recovery of
    Strootman
    Clasie
    Roben

  7. wilson says:

    So another friendly has been been confirmed for NT vs England in March.

  8. TIJU1234 says:

    Roben starts for Bayern…any one watching,cannt watch for some time will be travelling…Was rusty last time he played..is he really fit enough??

  9. TIJU1234 says:

    Ake starts for Watford,,Berghius not even in bench..
    Peiters starts as Afellay and Ginkel sits in bench…is Ginkel is developing??by sitting in bench..

  10. ARS says:

    Very good work.

    (I would gambled(intuition) and left Hiddink until the end of qualifying..
    .. In this case Danny Blind has got a hot potato in the hands.(who knows,maybe it is good for later …))

    ………….
    “”And it should be led by KNVB.With a clear strategy for football identity and development.We need to stop allowing a lawyer to determine that.We need wise man to come together.We need to get a development strategy to support the clubs and we need to learn to use systems in our teams that are based on the player material we have.””
    …………
    But
    We have a well established the football roads.(For the Dutch NT are also important these roads.)
    This roads often end up with:”I play in Barca,ManU,ManC,PSG,Juve,Chelsea…and you?”
    (In the Dutch case it looks like a hypnosis.This roads.)

    Because
    We need coaches (with eagle eyes)who can do things which we can not predict…example ..Co Adrianse and Hatenboer(Groningen) on the right back position..and similar things..

  11. wilson says:

    Martin Zeegelaar also started on LW for Rio Ave and also scored vs Estoril but unfortunately conceded a late equalizer in the injury time to drop points and could slip from third on the table.

  12. wilson says:

    Based on Marten De Roon rating in Serie A.he has had a explosive work rate for Atalanta in the midfield and has become a revelation for them in the engine room, regardless of them winning or losing. I really can’t remember who said this about him being a average player but seems like he has become a key man for them especially in the midfield.

  13. TIJU1234 says:

    WIJNALDUM VS LENZ OUR BEST PLAYERS IN EPL…
    1-0 FOR LENZ SO FAR,gini is bit unlucky..
    Newcastle reminds me of current dutch team,i mean 1 step ahead and 2 step back…

  14. TIJU1234 says:

    both depay and blind on bench….as expected happy for Manu and it sad for blind though i know he is not better than rojo,smalling and jones…

  15. Steve M says:

    Really impressed with Bazoer at Ajax, developing so quickly.
    Such a good hard fought goal he scored versus Vitesse to put Ajax ahead.. and then the post shortly after.
    Lets see how if they can close the game out.
    Really need to keep him in the senior squad now IMO.

    Watching the crappiest stream, but better than watching the boring Manchester derby.
    United with 0 shot attempts in the first half tells you everything. Both sides are playing very conservative midfields. Was watching for a while, Rooney looks so bad again. Is Rooney being so awful this season one of the reasons Memphis is not adjusting more easily and such bad form?

  16. Steve M says:

    Clasie to make his first start for Southampton today at Liverpool, very much a baptism of fire.
    van Dijk also starts and Steks is back between the the sticks.

    • Steve M says:

      Decent first half, 0-0
      Clasie playing CDM in front of van Dijk playing LCB. Wanyama doing the same to the right side, keeping a solid block of 6 when Liverpool are in possession – the usual away strategy for Koeman which shows results.
      Jordy is slowly gaining confidence, staying compact defensively and generally keeping Liverpool out of the middle well.
      Love his tenacity and his ability to make clearances land on his teammates feet.
      van Dijk flawless in the air and really dangerous on free kicks, should have scored a free header but scuffed the header wide.

      • van banger says:

        Yeah Virgil was really strong today it’s a shame he did not get good contact on that early header to put Southampton up 1-0. Clasie will only get better as he gets used to the speed of the game.

    • Steve M says:

      Good second half as well.
      Clasie withdrawn for the final 15 mins and Benteke scores 1 minute later, hah!
      He second on tackles though and had the most interceptions for either side, so a positive start for Clasie.
      Game ends 1-1

  17. Steve M says:

    RvP v Sneijder in turkey today.
    Huntelaar benched..

    Hoedt and Rekik both injured?
    Neither are even on the bench today for their respective clubs

    Promes had a double today, tied for most goals in Russia

  18. TIJU1234 says:

    what is happening with kuyt,everyday hatrick….he must be laughing about hiddink and blind…

    • bobotoh says:

      What is Kuyt position at Feyenoord? Central striker? I think he was a top scorer when he was in Holland before moving to Liverpool.

      • TIJU1234 says:

        kuyt plays as striker main striker…they have a nice combination team for feynoord,lads are so young,they are tremendous work rate and leadership skills of kuyt..kuyt is poor at one on one finishing but he is good at positioning it helps to do many tap ins.then comes his strength heading,and he has nice vision for passes too..So fits the team like a puzzle,hence team gets more balanced..any ways if play against a tough defensive team kuyt is not the anwser for striker,coz we need players who can score from vaccum..Now he looks better than RVP,hunter …and Luuk

  19. van banger says:

    Great post Jan, I think I agree pretty much with everything you have said, especially the part about desire, I call it “playing for the shirt” I spoke about this along time ago and it still remains a major problem for the Dutch , I think it always has been!
    Top photo of You and “The great One”, I’m sure he will battle through this and come out the other side better than ever, hopefully they caught it early!
    @Tiju – you questioned how Van Ginkle is developing off the bench at Stoke, I’m pretty sure it has something to do with people complaing to Mark Hughes about giving MVG a starting spot when he is on loan from Chelsea. If you remember back he was starting most games early in the season and doing quite well, I could be wrong but he is still only young so I have high hopes for him.

    • TIJU1234 says:

      @Vanbanger
      “”Van Ginkle is developing off the bench at Stoke,”””
      its was sarcastic question asked by me based on frustration of stupid move done by Ginkel to stoke..i expected Ginkel to sit on bench and hence stalk his development.its sad to see that…unless he finds a good dutch coach i feel bad him…like u he was always in my list,since age is running fast and this is the time to play ..while Ginekl is sitting in bench…wat to do i am helpless..

  20. TIJU1234 says:

    how many matche dutch going to play in november friendly?//
    Wales vs Netherlands then??/
    When will he announce team…?squad?

  21. ARS says:

    Germany?17th November

  22. ARS says:

    Wales-Netherlands 13th November 2015
    Germany-Netherlands 17th November 2015
    Netherlands-France 25th March 2016
    England-Netherlands 29 March 2016
    In May and August(2016) have not yet determined opponents….one of them might Belgium,Portugal(?)….

    • TIJU1234 says:

      Good lines Thnaks ARS..

    • Dozer says:

      Hardly the right opposition condidering the state we are in. We will most likely lose all these games (except maybe wales) and continue to sink likr a rock on the fifa rankings. We should be playing teams like luxembourg, finland, andorra right now. We need to get that winning mentality back. But these games were of course planned when knvb thouhgt we were going to the euros. Meeting germany in a month, with blind as coach and a demoralised team, omg we will be slaughtered.

      • TIJU1234 says:

        No Depay,afellay will be kings against andora and co..We want players who can play against france,germany,spain,etc…

        • Dozer says:

          So do I, but unfortunately, we do not have such players at the moment. Our current coach does not make the situation any better. It does not matter which dutch players he picks for these games, we will lose because of Blind’s tactical set-up. He will most likely chose a 4-3-3, trying to control ball possession and attack through short passing triangulation in the center of the pitch. That’s the way we played against Iceland, the Czechs and against Turkey. We lost all games by allowing the opponent to counter attack against us. And, Germany is the best counter attacking side in the world. Which combination of Dutch players do you think can get a good result against the Germans?

          • TIJU1234 says:

            player with tactical intelligence,with sacrifice and vision with hardwork will get us win vs any team..
            i do agree we lack efficient players up front…
            only one good news is that Roben is on fire again..
            Annholt—–Wijndlum—-Roben
            ————Snijder———
            ——-Hendrix—Bazoer—–
            —Kongolo—Reikik–Devrij—Hahtboer
            ————–Vermeer—————
            Would be able to beat any team…
            on bench
            Lenz——-Luuk——–vanrhijn
            ———Clasie—————
            —–Blind—–Ake———–
            Dijks—Raidwald—Vanbeek—-Tete
            ————GKs——————-
            Should form a decent 23..

  23. TIJU1234 says:

    once again united crashed out..blind and depay played ..depay was the worst player along with rooney…blind was ok to average..end of depay may be he will move to bodybuilding championships.

  24. TIJU1234 says:

    i wish danny blind plays
    Depay———-RVP——–promes
    ———–Afellay————-
    —–klassen—Blind————-
    Buttner—BMI—-Virjil—–Weil
    ———-Cillssen—————–
    Vs in coming first frendly….So that he understand how weak his slections are,this is how we can expose our weak players..

  25. Steve M says:

    Decent matches tomorrow.
    Robben will likely play v Frankfurt.
    I doubt van der Wiel plays twice in a row for PSG, he has actually been good with his few chances but Aurier has been better.
    Fer and Chery should play as well, for QPR

  26. Stephan says:

    Thought this might be interesting to share – a few Cruyff and one Van Gaal fan anecdotes:

    http://www.theguardian.com/football/2015/oct/30/pele-cruyff-best-barnes-stories-meeting-footballers

    I imagine the posters on this site have a fair few stories to share about when they met footballers in real life!

  27. andrew says:

    Stephan, Really good. Thank you for posting.

  28. wilson says:

    Napoli also pushing for Klassen.

  29. Steve M says:

    Robben was good, still a little rusty but played 90 mins and still created the most chances
    Also got yellow for imbellishment.. Bayern lose 0-0 😉

    van der Wiel played 90 RB as usual along with Aurier at CB.. maybe awarded for playing well when he had chances, then again Blanc is very good at rotating players..

    Didn’t see any of QPR but they lost, Fer not even on the bench

  30. Steve M says:

    Maybe tmr we can see Wijnaldum Janmaat and Anita versus Pieters van Ginkel and Afelaay. Could be interesting.

    Will Memphis / Blind start? Prob not
    Ake probably, hopefully Berghuis can make the bench at least. Not an injury prob. I read his manager criticize him for being lazy in training recently..

    Maybe Huntelaar can get his mojo back.. and hopefully Dost keeps putting goals in.
    Must be our most in form striker.. besides Luuk de Jong!

    • TIJU1234 says:

      Wijnaldum and Janmaat would play..anita might too…
      Peiters is certain starter…Ginkel need to join to dutch club…best is PSV or ajax.Do nt care about afellay..
      Memphis injured..he is lucky that he escaped or else would be having another artociuos evening..
      Blind wont start over Rojos(LB) and Johnes LCB)…may late on he might came in for schwentiger or carrick..
      My hopes are Dost and wijnaldum..rest i do think will have good game.

      • TIJU1234 says:

        dont think bar peiters

      • Steve M says:

        Nope, Blind is starting.. maybe Jones is hurt, not on the bench, Jones is awful anyways haha

        Anita starting as well, van Ginkel and Afelaay remain benched..

        I’m not an Afelaay fan either but but I think it’s good for everything if he plays well and I don’t see much point in ruling anyone out.

        • TIJU1234 says:

          Jones was good of late….he was not awful,he pocketed mancity.
          Really doomed about Ginkel..he Should have styed in eredivise like Gini and developed furthur..poor boy went to hell of a club..
          i think Afellay is 29 and his time is basically over to contribute to NT or any team…Even when at his peak i felt he is just a useless dribbler…next flop is possibly our Bodybuilder..i hope he wont flop…

  31. Steve M says:

    Great play from Ake on the first Watford goal also leading his side in tackles.
    Needs to give the ball away less but he’s really owning that LB spot at Watford! They win 2-0

    Pieters Janmaat Anita and Wijnaldum all pretty solid. Afelaay van Ginkel and S de Jong all came on too but didn’t do much.
    0-0 tells the story.. it was pretty dull.

    Huntelaars slump continues..

    • TIJU1234 says:

      i really dont know why Danny blind not calling real talented ones for NT..i mean Ake,Hendrix,bazoer…and he keeps on calling flop ones Depay,Afellay etc…
      its sad to see Manu like this,they play boring game ,finally i must say SAF >LVG…

  32. Steve M says:

    Found a decent link to an Ajax match (for once!) and Bazoer not even playing v Roda!?
    Klaassen looking really good though.. up 3-0 and first half not even over

  33. Steve M says:

    Donyell Malen hit a hat-trick for Arsenal U18’s today beating Reading 4-3..

  34. Steve M says:

    bad news for de vrij, will be out for a long time.. having corrective surgery this week on his knee.
    some good news tho, strootman has started training again with a running session on the pitch

  35. Steve M says:

    Interested to see who Blind picks, surprised he has not even chosen a provisional squad yet..
    Will we see changes which we so desperately need??

    • TIJU1234 says:

      i think Blind is damned and doomed,thats why he is not yet called provisional squad.Blind needs a mentor who can show the light…definitely i can do that,but Blind will underestimate me.

  36. TIJU1234 says:

    Clasie and Vandijk is winning with southampton….
    Sunderland with Annholt got blown away by everton..
    could nt see both match as now its half time for clasie and Virjil..
    Annholt should say good bye to LB spot and he must concentrate on LW..

  37. Steve M says:

    van Dijk was pretty decent, bossy as usual.
    Had a few errors in the second half when when Bournemouth were pressing hard in the 2H.. but did not give any direct opportunities.
    Southampton win 2-0 with 10 men.
    Clasie was very good, I thought. Hardly gave anything in the middle, except a little before he subbed off (big mistake by Koeman actually m, but did not pay for it), but maybe his lungs are not quite there yet. Also he had a brilliant pass in the buildup to the first goal.
    Partners Wanyama well in the middle, they trade off (as they should) but you can see Jordy moves to the position quicker or more naturally than Wanyama.
    Clasie controls a teams’ rhythm really well. Needs to keep it simple though.. you can see him try lower percentage passes as his confidence grows.

    But for me, any suggestion of him being too small for CDM/CM is made up for in spades by his awareness and technique.
    Hands down far superior to Blind/ Klaassen/ Anita/ Hendrix any other CDM option we have now, not including N de Jong who doesn’t play anymore (not since Sept and he is not injured, and that’s at a mid table Italian club, hah!)

  38. Steve M says:

    damn, no starts for Hoedt or Kishna..

    but elsewhere, Rekik is starting for Marsielle again.
    And ricky van wolfswinkel is making his first start for Betis, with van der Vaart on the bench

  39. wilson says:

    Zeegelaar also scored the winner for Rio Ave and are tied with Porto on points, though Porto has played one less.

  40. wilson says:

    Kishna scored a late consolation for lazio. Milan winning 3-1

  41. wilson says:

    Stefano Denswil also has started conservatively for Club Brugge after his injury come back. Was deployed at RCB in the last game.

    • TIJU1234 says:

      Forget Denswil we have better options
      Tete,Raidwald,Karsdrop,Hatboer,Virjil,Reikik.Kongolo,Van beek and bruma…So why stick arround denswill??????

      • wilson says:

        Typical in the box type of thinking.this is the kind of mentality which has crumbled NT on both knees.

        if you r looking for CB with real balls then Denswil is the man.pity he was not given a chance at Ajax but definitely a true defender in my books.

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c3k9hB2IZEY

        Love this compilation, the music too.

        • TIJU1234 says:

          this guy must be dropped for a reason by FDB,i dont know,i saw him vs barca for ajax in CL…like others he also error prone…
          so my hope is less for guys moves to a belgian club…

          • wilson says:

            So who isn’t error prone??

          • TIJU1234 says:

            let him play in a competitive league at first,Blegium league is weaker than eredivise.Depay was a king against club brugge…same Depay was peanut vs all british teams…All others are playing and showing their potential,while Denwill faded form main stream…considering ur history. i am not surprised about ur likings and eventual follow up of some crap players.this doesnt mean that Denswil is crap he looks better than many.i think u r having a delusion about denswil quality..

  42. van banger says:

    I just watched a replay of ManU v Palace game, palace were by far the more creative and better overall and should have won. I feel for Van Gaal as his squad is average at best a far cry from the ManU squads of the past, they are really lacking a star player, I was hoping it would be Memphis but again the step up to the EPL from the Erdevise is too much for him. Hopefully with time he can become a special player for NT.
    Glad to hear that Classie had a good game, let’s see if he can do that consistently, as that seams to be the major problem with the Dutch players ATM.

    • TIJU1234 says:

      IF U STOP Antony martial then Manu becomes impotent….Memphis is an overrated player with bad confidence..He fought with Joshua brenet in PSv at training once again with RVP in NT…He needs to be dropped.Most overrated player in last 15 years in orange.

      • TIJU1234 says:

        He consistently loose balls at important moments,and zero assist in PL so far..One of the worst player of Manu in this season with Rooney. Interesting thing is that both had hell of support from LVG..

  43. TIJU1234 says:

    What is Danny blind doing..is he sleeping for long time??No provisional squad yet…

  44. TIJU1234 says:

    http://sportwitness.ning.com/forum/topics/after-memphis-depay-bust-up-star-told-he-ll-never-be-picked-again
    one down from NT arround other 7 to go
    next in order
    Afellay,weil,Promes,Depay,Narsingh,BMI,Hunter…

  45. TIJU1234 says:

    finally…ja aja jajajaja
    RVP out,hunter out,afellay out Depay out,weil out…..Blind is not BLIND NOW….
    its a good sign
    But still there is promes arround..
    Anita,klassen,blind..3 of them are inferior to Bazoer,hendrix.that is were main thread hangs..midfeild is still very very weak.i dont understand it…
    Vletman VS vanbeek…cannt comment..

  46. TIJU1234 says:

    Netherlands squad in full:

    Goalkeepers: Jasper Cillessen (Ajax), Maarten Stekelenburg (Southampton), Kenneth Vermeer, Jeroen Zoet (PSV).

    Defenders: Jeffrey Bruma (PSV), Virgil van Dijk (Southampton), Daryl Janmaat (Newcastle United), Terence Kongolo (Feyenoord), Karim Rekik (Marseille), Jairo Riedewald (Ajax), Kenny Tete (Ajax), Joel Veltman (Ajax).

    Midfielders: Daley Blind (Manchester United), Vurnon Anita (Newcastle United), Jordy Clasie (Southampton), Davy Klaassen (Ajax), Wesley Sneijder (Galatasaray), Marko Vejinovic (Feyenoord), Georginio Wijnaldum (Newcastle United).

    Attackers: Bas Dost (Wolfsburg), Eljero Elia (Feyenoord), Anwar El Ghazi (Ajax), Luuk de Jong (PSV), Quincy Promes (Spartak Moscow), Arjen Robben (Bayern Munich).

    • bobotoh says:

      Who will be the DM? Holland must have someone who can play as a DM like Rijkaard or Davids.

      If it is to me, then it should be 3-5-2:
      —————Cillesen———————-
      —Bruma—–Van Dijk———-Rekik——-

      ———–DM—————————-
      -JanMaat —-Clasie——–Blind——–
      ———-Sneijder————–
      ——–Robben————————–
      ——–Dost/Luuk———————–

      Blind is good in long passing, while Janmaat is very good in crossing.

    • vanfadly says:

      Huntelaar’s actually innit. this one’s same as in Goal.com but other sources mentioned him.

  47. wissor3 says:

    I wouldn’t look too much into player selection. Both RvP and Depay got the boot most likely because of the bust up. They are both warming the bench at their clubs, Depay is hurt as well. Last but not least, Blind will probably want to test some players.

    • TIJU1234 says:

      Player selection of right players are very bottom basics of a winning team,there is lot in selecting Roben over Promes/Afellay…etc.its all about individual quality..only exception case is that if a talented player plays like a 60 year old.then it would be better to replace him with a hardworking one..

  48. Steve M says:

    Ballsy moves by Blind regarding RvP and Memphis, some quotes:

    BM: “The most important name that has not been called up is Robin van Persie. What is his current status?”

    DB: “His status. I find that since his transfer to Fenerbahce in the summer that he has still not found his rhythm after 4 months there. He is still not playing the full 90 minutes. I believe that he has played one full game for Fenerbahce and that is of course not a good sign. A player of that caliber that does not play full games after a few months and is put on the bench and does not appear to play more than an hour. I have seen him play and he has not played well. I do not find him sharp. We are entering into a new period where perhaps certain players will not come into consideration should we manage to qualify for Russia and I want and must see other players in his position so I will call them up instead because I have to look to the future.”

    BM: “So this is not temporary it is for good?”

    DB: “Not this is definitely not for good even though that is what I read. I have not selected Robin van Persie for these two games. I spoke to him a few times during the last international fixtures about this and the fact that I think that he must do better in order to start for his club and I hope that he manages to do that because he is still in terms of potential the best striker we have. But you must be in a position to play 90 minutes.”

    BM: “Yes I agree with you about that about being able to play for 90 minutes. But I thought we are entering a new period, the manager gives a press conference. He is creating a new squad and van Persie is not involved.”

    DB: “No I feel that we still have the need for experienced players and that they can still bring what is needed in top football. I hope that van Persie will be fit in March and then I will probably call him up because as I have already stated he is in terms of potential the best striker we have.”

    “I think Depay is a player for the future, but there are other issues we’ll look at – maybe Louis van Gaal has also mentioned that.”

    “In football, you must also function in a team – and he doesn’t always do that. I told him that when I called him to say he wasn’t in the squad. It’s something he has to learn.”

    • Steve M says:

      Of course, LvG defends his player:
      “I have said that he is the greatest talent of his age but he is also only 21 and that is also an age you cannot expect consistency.
      He is also in a phase of his career where he has to adapt to many things so I have expected this. But I am convinced he is coming back, maybe stronger than before.
      But we have to give him time”

      • TIJU1234 says:

        he can only comes back if he stops body building and finds true speed..which seems unlikely..i think he has a good future body building championship …

      • TIJU1234 says:

        Yet again we are in trouble in midfeild,no real holidng mid..
        klassen,blind..clasie and anita are too light weight for the break up Job…I think trio of Ake,Hendrix and Bazoer were the best we have now..with clasie…
        i dont see anything special in Vejinovic,offcourse he is better than afellay..

    • van banger says:

      Very interesting comments, I’m not convinced we have a strong squad at all, as Tiju has said the midfield is weak, and for all of the Depay/Van Persie bashing, you have to question the service they have gotten from the midfield- piss poor IMO!
      But it looks like RIP – RVP! I thank him for his many goals and great play over the years he will always be one of my most respected players for NT and club.
      DM – what about Virgil? He has all of the attributes required big strong good passer good feet left and right reads the game well, I would go with him there and let him protect the CB’s.

      • TIJU1234 says:

        @Van banger…
        agree midfeild was poor for a long time still we are poor,untill we find right candidates in midefild those are Ake,Hendrix and Bazoer,Clasie to an extent..
        About RVP,his problem was his availiblity ,stamina and speed…he doesnt have any of this now,even if he gets suply he cannt do it as he has to move constantly in box which he is not capabe of anymore.i think Fenerbache has given enough support to him from Midfeild ,still he cannt make it..
        About Depay he is a ball looser,with too much concentraytion of take on finally loose th ball at some point..he doesnt have the speed of Young,martial or Roben,hence he cannt pick up passe from Snijder,Bastein,shinderlin,Blind etc…so about him its lack of quality and accuracy and lacks extra pace…
        He is not a better winger than annholt,wijnaldum ,Roben and Elgahzi or even Ola john..

  49. TIJU1234 says:

    LIKE FATHER LIKE SON???????
    WATCH JUSTIN KLUIVERT

  50. Miguel Rosado says:

    I liked this squad. RVP and Depay out is a sign of authority by Blin which I like. You must be fit and playing or you won’t get called.

    What do you guys know about Marko Vejinovic? I watched him only on youtube and looks really good.

    We have players who can be great but they are in a period of their careers where they need to mature to be more consistent.

    For instance Wijnalum scored 4 goals but he is not amazing everyweekend.

    • TIJU1234 says:

      if u compare with Depay and Wijnaldum ,wijnaldum is amazing at every single week…u need to consider that wijnaldum plays in a bottom team and Depay has Martial,mata,snhiderlin etc…am not counting Rooney..So wijnaldum is deal in every weak..
      Almost all crap players are dropped by blind.only one headlesschiken remaining thats Promes…
      i do feel uncomfortable with trio of Anita,klassen and Blind,i know they are good players but i feel safe with Ake,Hendrix and Bazoer all are dazzling at thir clubs and has physical authority over opponents..
      our midfeild is still weak IMO

    • Robin O'Brien says:

      I agree, Miguel, regarding both RVP/Depay and Wijnaldum comment. Hopefully a wake up call for both RVP and Memphis.

    • Tomy14 says:

      I have seen one game of Feyenoord so far and I was very impressed by Marko Vejinovic.

  51. Miguel Rosado says:

    I wasn’t comparing Depay and Wijnaldum. I was talking about how our younger players don’t shine every week.

    It also happened to Sneijder, Robben, Huntelaar, RVP when they were younger. They also struggled to find the right team, they also struggled to show how good they are.

    • TIJU1234 says:

      IF”””is the word i used,to point out how well wijnaldum is performing compared to a hyped one..Even at not his best Wijnaldum plays better than bodybuilder..

  52. bobotoh says:

    So, the natural holding midfielders are Vurnon and Vejinovic. Where is Nigel De Jong?

  53. Steve M says:

    Massive win for PSV today, very competitive/open group.. Propper was very good, has a great partnership with Guardado going..
    Bruma, Brener and L de Jong were really good as well, and good for Cocu benefitting from including both de Jong and Locadia who had a great finish for his goal.

  54. Steve M says:

    Clasie is the best Dutch CDM picked in my opinion. Just as v Argentina/ Brazil and now Southampton beside Wanyama.
    Vejinovic is decent but wouldn’t be playing if Clasie was still in Feyenoord! Anita is probably better too but still Vejinovic is a good prospect, won’t make the final cut though anyways but nice for Blind to acknowledge his playing well. Also if Bazoer was fit he’d be there instead.

    We’ve already seen Blind and Klaassen play CDM. I was disappointed with both, even though I like them normally evidently playing them out of the position they are currently playing is not the best..

    Clasie is ready, especially considering he is playing directly in front of van Dijk.
    Clasie’s height is his only disadvantage I think, but with a back line of Kongolo van Dijk Bruma and Tete then there is no lack of height..

    Actually I think Clasie will make a perfect CM/CDM partner with Bazoer!
    Add any of Wijnaldum/ Sneijder/ Klaassen / Propper/ Maher and you have a deadly mid 3

    I have a bad feeling that Daley will be CDM, would be a mistake,. though I do like Danny’s bold choice to leave Memphis out.
    Need players who play for the team, not themselves.
    RvP makes sense too.
    Will Huntelaar find form again? Sneijder keeps producing now but how long can that last? Blind must believe they can play an important part of WC qualifiers, seems like he realizes he should wave goodbye otherwise..

    • TIJU1234 says:

      dropping Depay was the biggest decision in 15 years of dutch football..Many cannt think of it..
      Claise and snijder are excellent players…u need to add muscle and height in midefiled to win battles,thats how it get balanced,Southmapton claise has Wanyama,Snijder has Felipe melo..
      @steve never say wilson to that Luuk De jong is excellent,Luuk dejong is a wonderful team combination player u get best from him when they work as team..

      • wilson says:

        Work as team hah,seriously what have you being watching all this time. With Sneijder and Robben forget about team work.

        Being a team player was the reason why he never flourished in bundasliga and EPL.

        Though he is a good finisher his technical ability is zero. That’s why he always brings in the wingers to make the runs in the box.

        • TIJU1234 says:

          With Sneijder and Robben forget about team work.””””””this is good point they are not 100 percent team workers…but their decision making is good on feild i mean when to pass when to hold,though sneijder shoots so often with out much accuracy and hence wasting some half chances..
          Luuk de jong is an excellent player when wokr with certain players…thats what my point is..
          What is ur point?
          ””’Though he is a good finisher his technical ability is zero. That’s why he always brings in the wingers to make the runs in the box.””””””””””””
          is that…i would say even with zero percentage techical ability he is more useful than afellay…

          • wilson says:

            Well that remains to be seen at NT level and how it tends out for him. You always get obsessed with club football.I remember you shared the very SAME sentiment about Siem De Jong when he was at Ajax but when it came to NT he turned out to be average like others.he was also a very good team player with zero technical ability.

            You jus cant expect to go to a club expecting everything gonna turn out in you favor or in others words you will fit in every team as a team player. This is why he flopped in other leagues. You look at Elia, same story and get the call up.

  55. TIJU1234 says:

    luuk—Dost/Elgahzi
    Annholt-Elghazi
    roben–wijnaldum
    Snijedr–clasie/Maher
    Bazoer—Ake—-/anita
    Hendrix–Proper/Vanginkel
    Williams-kongolo
    Raidwald–Virjil/Reikik
    Devrij–=-Bruma../Vanbeek
    Tete—–Hateboer/Karsdrop/Janmaat
    this should be our pool of players…

  56. van banger says:

    Tete Veltman. Bruma
    Van Dijk
    Jaanmat Classie. Snjieder. Wijnaldum

    Robben. Klassen
    Dost

    Something to think about!

  57. van banger says:

    Sorry Dost is out Vermeer in.

  58. TIJU1234 says:

    De vrij is out for 6 months…lets see how we cop with that…kuyt is the top scorer in eredivise,De boer expecting RVP willl be good aganist Ajax for fener..i think thats a bad guess..

  59. bobotoh says:

    There are four players that play in the CL: Robben, Dost, Memphis, and Blind. But, I think only Robben that is a world class player.

    • bobotoh says:

      I mean, the players that play in the foreign club. Because Holland still have PSV. I hope for the best for PSV. I think they are in good position to advance to the next phase.

  60. TIJU1234 says:

    i dont know how many of u remmber u23 in Isreal turnament ECu23…
    olajohn—-Luuk——–Wijladum
    ———Maher————–
    —Strootman—Ginkel———-
    Blind—BMI–Drvij—-Vanrhijn
    ———GK—————-
    Was our firstchoice 11 in all matches…
    the team didnt had a Roben or Snijder..but they excelled as team thourg hardwork and intelligence…
    Only certainquality players we had on bench was Fer,Clasie and to some extend Locadia..
    We misserbaly failed against SPain when Depay,vanderhoorn,Jozefoon playednot just them we saw11 changes for spain game…i mean 8 nonquality players with formentioned 3 played…So its all baalcing the team with right players..
    Same can be done by Danny….

  61. wilson says:

    Robben selection is a big question mark for me. What the hell is Danny Blind trying to prove.these friendlys is for a new start for NT regardless of win or loss and to inject fresh and new legs. Don’t think he is needed in these friendlys but maybe in later stages.

    This jus shows NT is in wrong hands.

    • TIJU1234 says:

      The only senior players fit to play ATM by merit is Roben and nsijder ,i think they are there to lead the team.Since Strootman,and Vlaar are injured..
      i like to see Robens and Snijders Role off the pitch rather than in these friendly matches..we need them vs France,sweden etc,,,

    • Steve M says:

      Big question mark over picking the man he has selected as the captain now that he’s fit again?

      You would prefer Blind picks Bacuna?

      • TIJU1234 says:

        Wilson loves Afellay,Denswill,Buttner,Bacuna and many more…He cannt like Seim and luuk dejong,klassen,Blind etc…i dont know why….
        I think Blind has ignored 3 excellent players who fits the bill to face strong team such as France,germany etc…those are hendrix,ake and bazoer…i think they are much better than anita,Blind and Vejinovic..
        We need strong mid that is still not there…i do think if Anita is given chance he would play well…
        Roben is doubt to play…

  62. wilson says:

    Mean while Vlaar has confirmed he has completed his fitness comeback at AZ and is looking for a club.

  63. TIJU1234 says:

    @Steve do u follow Ajax????
    Today Victor fischer is there in line up..How u rate this guy??Is he better than Schone???even Serero??..i feel Ajax plays better with out fishcer..
    Ajax vd Fener
    RVP Vs dutch team..De boesr saying RVP will be motivated to beat Ajax…yes he will motivated as he axed from NT..But Cruyff also has same ambition to perform for NT.

    • Steve M says:

      I do, but don’t watch as much as I’d like to.. seems like only really poor quality streams where I live, hard to watch. So my opinion is limited for Eredivisie ..
      Yea I think he’s a bit better than Schone, seems to work harder and is in form thus starts more. Hard to compare Serero since they play different positions.

      Disappointing draw v Fenerbache.. Fischer and El Ghazi both went off injured, hopefully they are ok for the big Feyenoord match on Sunday.

  64. Dozer says:

    Ajax draw while Groningen lose (1 point so far). It was really bad luck for the Dutch League that Groningen qualified for the EL. They are really poor. I Think Feyenoord would have done better.

    Now, it is up to AZ.

    Good win by PSV earlier this week. FDR have a few things to learn from Cocu

  65. AZ-forever says:

    And unfortunately, my AZ were unable to help either. In fact, in attack they played really well, but defense was horrible.

    I agree we had too many clubs this season in Europe who have nothing to offer in this level of competition. First Go Ahead Eagles, then Groningen and even AZ with their brand new team can not cope with the rhythm of Europa League. I personally feel that none of three team playing in EL will be able to overwinter. Ajax have better chances but they play such a dull football…Groningen is already out as it has proven to be not their level. It is very painful to state but the level of Czech clubs now is higher than Dutch. With respect to my AZ, I do not think team with 8 brand new players is ready for this competition this year. The only team which we can hope for is PSV. With 80% chances in 2018 we will be represented by four teams with our champion losing its place in direct qualification to a group stage. I believe we will be allowed to list only four clubs to participate in Europe. I remember this type of situation happened in earily to mid 80s during dark ages for the Dutch football. So, as we see history repeats itself. The bright side of history repeating itself is that Dutch will be back again both at club and national level like they did starting from late 80s with PSV winning Champions Cup, Ajax crashing everybody in Europe in 90s and Oranje winning Euro-88.

    I beleive the future of Dutch football is bright but we just need to get patient and together with our team to go through the crisis.

  66. AZ-forever says:

    Oh I am sorry, I forgot about Vitesse who was unable to go through the first barrier.

  67. wilson says:

    Wow Blind makes a u turn. Depay in the squad to face Wales and Germany.

  68. wilson says:

    Full Netherlands squad: 
    Riechedly Bazoer (Ajax), Daley Blind (Manchester United), Jeffrey Bruma (PSV), Jasper Cillessen (Ajax), Jordy Clasie (Southampton), Memphis Depay (Manchester United), Virgil van Dijk (Southampton), Bas Dost (VfL Wolfsburg), Eljero Elia (Feyenoord), Klaas Jan Huntelaar (Schalke 04), Daryl Janmaat (Newcastle United), Luuk de Jong (PSV), Davy Klaassen (Ajax), Terence Kongolo (Feyenoord), Quincy Promes (Spartak Moscow), Jairo Riedewald (Ajax), Arjen Robben (Bayern Munich), Wesley Sneijder (Galatasaray), Maarten Stekelenburg (Southampton), Kenny Tete (Ajax), Marko Vejinovic (Feyenoord), Joël Veltman (Ajax), Kenneth Vermeer (Feyenoord) and Georginio Wijnaldum (Newcastle United).

  69. Tomy14 says:

    I would like to see these players starting

    ——————Cillessen ———-

    Janmaat—–Van Dijk—–Blind——-Riedewald

    —–Wijnaldum—–Vejinovic——-Klaassen

    —–Promes——–Dost———Robben

    • Tomy14 says:

      The only thing that worries me is the two slow center backs but we have no one better so i guess will have to go with them for now. No more Sneijder or Huntelaar, Rvp etc. We need to prepare for the WC and those guys will be to old for that, not to mention that from what i have seen in the previous games they don’t even deserve a call.

    • Steve M says:

      Cool, but why not Clasie over Vejinovic?

      • Tomy14 says:

        Clasie is fine with me to start but i chose Vejinovic since he’s been consistent with Feyenoord and because Clasie just came back from a long injury. Lets just give him a few more games with Southampton and then give him a shot as well.

    • bobotoh says:

      I don’t know which one is better: Bazoer or Vejinovic as holding midfielder. But, both of them must play for WC 2018 preparation.

      This friendly, of course, is part of the plan for WC 2018.

  70. Steve M says:

    Interesting, so Memphis probably needed to be included in the end since El Ghazi had to pull out.. Anita, Rekik and Zoet were also cut (from the provisional squad), and Bazoer comes in since he seems fit enough.

  71. Steve M says:

    U21 squad:

    Goalkeepers: Joël Drommel (FC Twente), Maarten de Fockert (sc Heerenveen), Mickey van der Hart (PEC Zwolle)

    Defenders: Nathan Aké (Watford FC), Sven van Beek (Feyenoord), Joshua Brenet (PSV), Hans Hateboer (FC Groningen), Rick Karsdorp (Feyenoord), Wesley Hoedt (Lazio), Karim Rekik (Olympique Marseille), Derrick Luckassen (AZ), Lucas Woudenberg (N.E.C. Nijmegen)

    Midfielders: Sean Klaiber (FC Utrecht), Dabney Dos Santos (AZ), Jorrit Hendrix (PSV), Joris van Overeem (AZ), Daley Sinkgraven (Ajax), Tonny Vilhena (Feyenoord)

    Attackers: Jean-Paul Boëtius (FC Basel), Vincent Janssen (AZ), Ricardo Kishna (Lazio), Queensy Menig (PEC Zwolle), Gyliano van Velzen (FC Volendam)

  72. wilson says:

    Cillessen

    Tete – Bruma – Van Dijk – Riedewald

    Wijnaldum – Clasie – Sneijder

    Robben-Dost-Depay

    This could be the starting lineup unless father decides to put son at either LB or DM.

    • Steve M says:

      How do you feel about Sneijder?
      I am torn about including him, not sure he will be as good next Sept when WC18 qualification starts.. but has he got more value than just on the pitch?
      I feel Robben is a step above every other oranje player and will def be an important part of the qualifiers whether he is as good as now or not.. and the current captain of course!

      Would you agree everything we do from now is about making the best team possible ready for that WC18 qualification?

      • Tomy14 says:

        Sneijder has been poor for Holland in the qualifiers. Its time to move on with some younger kids who can be available at the WC. I have no problem with him coming off the bench and helping the team out whenever needed.

        Totally agree on Robben. He is one player that the Dutch team cannot afford to lose.

      • wilson says:

        Sneijder could be a impact player in the qualifiers if he declines to some extent and as for WC, not now.As for his Successor I think this is the right time to start injecting some fresh legs there.though it is bit hard to say who it will but I guess this is where some experiment is needed. Maher or Clasie maybe.then there is also transfer window coming up and let’s see how the player movement will be in Jan.

      • TIJU1234 says:

        Luckily Maher and Clasie could replace Snijder..i mean Gap not so big between Clasie and Snijder ATM..but there is huge Gap Betwee Roben & RVP Vs Depay/Eelgahzi/Promes Afellay..thats huge downgrade of quality..

  73. wilson says:

    The one thing I would like to see is Blind creating that competitive environment where more players are given opportunity to compete for individual position. I’m optimistic about lazio contingent, Ake, and few other players who can aid this but again it’s all in the hands of Blind.

  74. TIJU1234 says:

    Roben and snijder should get leave and they must get rest from NT untill WCQ starts in August…
    Blind Should Appoint Wijnladum as Captian ans should build a team like Cocu did for PSV..
    Lets keep Strootman,Snijder and Roben for later..
    Now starts the real building
    Luuk—Dost
    Annholt–Vilhena
    Wijnaldum–Vanrhijn/Elgahzi
    Clasie—–Klassen/Maher
    Bazoer—–Ake
    Hendrix—Vejinovic/Proper
    Kongolo–Williams
    Reikik—Vrijil
    Devrij—Bruma/Vanbeek
    Janmaat/Tete–Hatboer/Karsdorp/Tete
    Cillsen,vermeer ,krul
    this should be our pool
    Depay is the carpiest player along with ronney for MAnu..

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