The New Coach, part 1.

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by Jan

We will most likely have a number of posts on this topic, before we can go to posts covering the actual new coach….

So, from all the names we’ve seen and heard, I think we can rule out Ronald Koeman and Frank de Boer. Both are committed at Eredivisie clubs and the KNVB will not lure a coach away from its members. Not done.

So, big sigh or relief ( in Koeman’s case… Although now I have him at Feyenoord :-(… But he does well there…so all good…)

The name of Louis van Gaal is dropped a lot too, but the media respond very badly to him. His tenure earlier was a drama. Not just the results, also his relationship with the media.

He resigned and had this live broadcast press conference ( no longer available on YouTube) where he basically screamed one last time at the press… “Are you happy now? Louis steps down?? Are you all gloating??”… Classic stuff.

I don’t think the KNVB will want him back.

Rijkaard’s agent already said Frank isn’t interested.

Guus isn’t interested. Dickie won’t do it ( Thank God)…

Danny Blind apparently is not well-liked

Co Adriaanse is obviously available but like Louis is seen as difficult to deal with.

The players would like him. Van Hagegem supports him.

Ruud Gullit is actually putting his hand up. Gullit did ok with the U21s and is seen as a great ambassador for the sports. Johan Derksen is publically supporting Ruud’s bid as he could be a key figure head internationally to restore our pride.

I don’t see Ruud in the lead role though. Because you do have to be a fairly good coach too… Derksen forgets that it’s important mostly, to get results to get international acclaim…

But Co in charge, with Ruud as side-kick for the PR and a strong field coach to work with the lads… Maybe two? Cocu steps down… Maybe someone like Ronald de Boer? And Jan Wouters? Or Patrick Kluivert (who won the title as coach of Twente 2)?

What a team!!

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    2. The KNVB won’t do it Sam. And Frank already said he’s not interested yet. DOn’t forget, it’s hard for a former assistant to take the top role with the same players. They use to fool around and moan to Frank about Bert and that is hard to leave behind….

    3. My dream team is FdB (I know its impossible) and Patrick Kluivert as his assistant. He was on Eurosport and his analytical and tactical abilities were impressive. I know he only had to talk, but since he did well at Twente I think he translates his theories into practice. Co Adriaanse – yes I’d like that. How can Danny Blind not be liked? Who does not like him? Gullit as a PR – yes, coach – no.

    1. Listen, Ruud worked for the KNVB before and he was one of the bid managers for Holland’s world cup bid. So he’s accepted by the bobos ( derogatory term for federation management) whereas Co is seen as a einzelganger and difficult bloke.

  4. New coach needs to…

    1. Earn the respect of the players.
    2. Be able to control egos.
    3. Be fair.
    4. Focus on defensive frailties and make improvements.
    5. Find a way to play both RVP and Hunter.
    6. Be able to have a plan B that all players understand.

    1. how about these BvM traits that need to be absolutely continued?

      1. Focus on a realistic way of playing.
      2. Result oriented strategies.
      3. We always play 90 mins at 100% even in friendlies.

      If we lose these 3 then we will go back to the dark ages again. We don’t get to produce Koeman/Gullit/vBasten too often.

  5. I really like what Prandelli is doing with Italy. He is changing the Italian way of playing defense after scoring one goal. So far he has been successful. In the past, I never liked Italy as a team even though I liked the players individually. Now I would like to see them win on Sunday.

  6. As we have all opined here in past threads, there were a number of things BVM failed to do.

    However, the more I think about it, one of the main problems with was his reluctance to try new players. It seemed like his favorite starting 11 was almost set in stone. Yes he changed a few players here and there but no matter how good some of those on the bench were performing or how bad the starters were, he stuck to his favorites.

    Starters become complacent. They start to have egos. Those on the bench feel like nothing they do is good enough. It creates resentment, gradual dislike and loss of respect for the coach.

  7. I honestly don’t think the ones mentioned will be successful with Holland. Although I liked Gullit as a player, he was a prima-donna himself. How can a prima-donna manage other similar prima-donnas?

    I also believe this is the beginning of a hibernation phase for Oranje. I expect a return to prominence but that won’t happen till the 2020 Euros.

    1. this coming generation will last around 10 years. So the first most likely chance will be WK 2022 … and *if* then… if we lose this generation, I expect WK 2026 … Oh boy … 14 years from now. LOL maybe I should just die.. seems easier hahahaha

    2. hibernation?

      explain yourself, while other countries have golden generations, Who is winning all the youth competitions in europe???

      Spain, Germany and Holland, u-17 euro champs, We won’t be going to sleep for a while, of course we aren’t going to win every tournament if thats what you mean.

      but we will always be contenders for every tournament we go to.

      1. >but we will always be contenders for every tournament we go to.

        exactly. Let’s go first to WK2014 because with some of the suggestions here (change all the players, try this and try that) maybe we will not go at all …

        1. i’m not saying change all the players, I”m saying we need to make small changes here and there, and have a realistic formation that we can operate. 4-2-3-1 was never the problem, it was the players in that formation, That central 4 man block meant to protect the centerbacks and stop all danger didn’t work. Van Bommel couldn’t get back, and there was no closing down, and heitinga just messed it up. and no maintaining the shape.

          I support a coach who makes positive changes. it’s not doom and gloom, A smart coach, will not lose the games versus turkey and estonia, romania and others.

          lets not forget if van persie makes his chances, we could easily beaten denmark, and been up 2-0 over germany, So all this gloom about not making the cup. it’s unfounded, Unless we have a shit game versus belgium, then we are in a bad trend.

          1. >it’s unfounded, Unless we have a shit game versus belgium, then we are in a bad trend.

            unfounded? LOL … we finished the EK with 0 points. We are in a bad trend already. A shit game with Belgium will make it considerably worse. A bad game with Turkey and this board will have no viewers.

          2. Ah, but there is the rub! Our past shows that we have always made rough travel with supposed “easy” qualifiers. Van Marwijk was the first coach who was able to get the national team to plow through the qualifiers.
            I agree with you in regards to our talent, and let’s be honest… the Euro’s showcase the best footballers in the world. And yes, with a couple of lucky bounces we easily beat Denmark and slip by the Germans. But then again… with a slight variation Rensenbrink nets the goal in ’78, Robben lifts the ball a centimeter past Casillas and we are champs. Or Jongbloed doesn’t just stare at Muller’s strike. Or conversely, van Basten doesn’t get the penalty against Germany in ’88, or Kieft’s crazy bounce doesn’t go in against the Irish in ’88… etc, etc, etc!

          3. That was the Bert Van Marwijk era, and as i said before, history could be soo much different, if van persie makes his shots, We could easily be out of the group and who knows.

            You act like we have the worst players in the world. and that we are somehow not as good as turkey, at least we made it to the euros, what did turkey do? with guus hiddink?

            changes will be made. and we will prove that we are the best. The bad players have been removed.

            If you want to keep being negative go ahead, but if Holland plays to Holland’s potential it should be a cakewalk

          4. let me clarify myself better.

            we do have bad form, by all form guides, but that bad form (trend) is with bert van marwijk, and the largely unchanged team.

            so now with a new coach, Even if it’s the same formation there will be new players. And with those new players, Creates a new trend. a completely new history.

            So after Belgium game, We will see not by result, but by how well we stop belgium, how well we create opportunities to score, what kind of new trend we have. it’s the start of something new.

            Lets not act like we will have mathijsen and heitinga as the same centerback pairing, and we’ll take paul bosvelt out of retirement and stick him next to nigel de jong. Come on

          5. “You act like we have the worst players in the world”

            Where in heavens name did I imply that? I simply point to our history of under achieving. We are known as “the Best Team never to have won a World Cup”, are we not? We are known as the “nearly men”, are we not?

            I am always convinced of our potential and our elite status as a footballing nation! That is unarguable. But somehow, someway, we always seem to make the simple very difficult. And my specific reply to you was geared toward “ifs”, and “would’ve and could’ve”.

          6. all i keep reading is all these bad things.

            oh we will never make another tournament for 10 years, 20 years.

            it’s just like 1978, we don’t have the talent.

            We don’t have the defense, what did we want bert van marwijk to do?

            Come on guys, we deserve to lose because we don’t play attacking football.

            Come on we lost because we didn’t play attacking football.

            without bert van marwijk we won’t qualify for world cup in brazil

            we don’t have anyone to replace bert van marwijk

            one moment we will win it, we lost to bulgaria pre-tournament right before, we lost first game just like 88, and we didn’t win the euros like 88

            now the next moment, we are just like 78, same team in 80, we won’t make it anymore.

            Oh please, all this negativity doesn’t make sense. I understand a lot of people are angry at the results, I almost broke my foot kicking my coach. . And then got depressed watching the games.

            But still, all it takes is one look at our teams. and see soo many dutch youngsters wanted across europe, by big teams to know. We are in uncharted waters. this isn’t gonna be like the past before. and we might learn some lessons which will help us win the world cup.

            The same way giovanni van bronkhorst said after the euros, that he didn’t know we had those performances in us, and lack of concentration led to our downfall, and we would not take others lightly, and we almost won it in 10.

            So now our lesson is simple. We have to rejuvenate, we can’t be static.

      2. I agree no need to despair, and even before those generations you mention there is a lot: I think that Anita Stroot Viergever Nuytinck Buttner Narsingh vRhijn Luuk Wwinkel Maher , many others could be ready in the next 2 yrs. We have Sneijder Robben and Hunt, next in line Maduro emmanuelson elia…

        And there´ s so much talent behind that… every coach loves to work this team-

      3. It’s cyclic, and more importantly, there is history behind it. This latest team had far too much in common with the ’74 generation national team wise (excepting the style of play of course!). This last Euro bore striking similiarities to the ’80 Euro for the Dutch. The build up (coming off a 2nd place finish at the WK, and arriving with largely the same team unchanged from the WK, and with the same tactics, drawn into a tough group [with the Germans again!], crashing out in the Group stages with much gnashing of teeth and and blaming) mirrors almost to a tee.
        What followed was an 8-year absence, with 2 close calls (84 Euro Qualifiers & 86 WC UEFA playoff) before we hit paydirt in 1988. And this was done with a young and talented group that started to make inroads into the National Team starting about 1983, with the addition of Gullit and and a young van Basten.
        So if you believe in cycles, and you see the similar backgrounds, it is entirely feasible that we drift around for a bit. And do not forget; It was van Marwijk who finally showed the Oranje how to really plow through the qualifiers. Almost every tournament we had ever qualified for (including the ’74 WK) had brutal and anxious moments. We should at least give van Marwijk his due in that regard. Expect that a return to free flowing and attacking football will also have the side effect of hiccups during qualifying.
        We could very well be looking in from the outside in 2014.

        1. we need more posters like you… don’t get me wrong I like to be optimistic but the similarities you pointed are eerie. That’s why KNVB needs to think not just twice but 200x. I know the money for Hiddink are a lot but if we go into a downward spiral the damage will be much much higher.

          1. Thanks! We also seem to be rooted into a Dutch coach, which at first would seem to be a “no brainer”. But look at teh ’78 team. Ernst Happel was Austrian. Van Hanagem loved playing for him, and expressed lasting regret at not playing for Ernst in ’78.
            So maybe, just maybe, we look outside the box for a tournament. Blasephemy? Maybe, but the history is already there.

          2. have 0 issues with a non-Dutch coach. But I don’t think KNVB will spring the money for Pep. If they shell the big bucks, it would be for Guus. But hypothetically, I would be ok with Pep or others worthy.

            Happel is my childhood hero. I have to visit Vienna and take a pic in front of the stadium (Pratter) that has been renamed to his honor.

            He is the best Oranje coach in my memory…

  8. I think we should leave Frank De Boer at Ajax now. I see Frank De Boer taking charge of Oranje after World Cup 2014. Let him gain some more experiences, working a bit more with Ajax and its players. He will have a chance to study his opponents (Feyenoord, PSV,…Champion League) and will be able to select good players for Oranje.
    As much as I would like to see Oranje playing attractive football, I think the new coach should have a vision of how the team plays, select the players to fit the style or somehow can make the current players fit into this effective system. If he chooses to keep the same group of core players, he need to understand their strengths and weakness, then somehow maximize those strengths and improve their weakness. For example, if the coach comes in and say we will play 3-4-3 and these players simply cannot play (eg their defense is not strong enough) then it is suicidal. He can choose to play attractive football only if these players understand his vision and put the team first (over individual).
    I like the idea of Co as coach and Gullit as the team PR. Gullit as coach? NO.

  9. Ruud does not look so good in Wiki… I dont know if I feel comfy going into the WC (and qualifying )with a coach who failed almost everywhere, no matter how good his ways with the press.
    I want a real trainer, Co/vanGaal with Ronald de Boer or with Alfons Groenendijk, his teams always play very nice combination football.
    I would like Co with groenendijk and Ronald, 2 tacticians who can balance eachother, and Ronald for spirit and fire.

    Everybody is talking in dutch media now but 3 persons that usually talk a lot in these situations, dont talk at all; cruyff vgaal and Co- not a word from them…

    1. That is telling. Not a peep yet from Cruijff.

      What I wouldn’t give to be a fly on the wall in his office! I know it is impossible, but he probably regrets not giving the K.N.V.B. slot a go in 1994 after the “almost” job with them in 1990, and to this day I am betting he sometimes wonders what might have been…

  10. alright lets just chill out with this and look at it with realistic expectations.

    What do we know?

    We Have Some of the Best players on the planet, When robben is in “form” he is up there with messi and ronaldo, but he gets injured and has bouts of uselessness. We have sneijder a pass master who can do great, and his game will last a long time. We got plenty of strikers, wingers, that shouldn’t be a worry.

    quite Simply we are loaded, The group stage should have never happened, Anyone who thinks we are not loaded, is delusional. every country would at least want one or two of our players to make themselves a better country, You think spain would hesitate to start robin van persie if he was Robin Sanchez? You think brazil would hesitate if robben was Robbeninho?

    What are the Realities of International Football?

    the quality is low, guys don’t get much practice together, and it’s easier to defend and counter, then it is to attack. Even spain doesn’t attack, they possess.

    So this idea of a club coach using his club tricks to get a team to play just won’t work. Besides things to do for fitness everything is mental.

    Spain’s dirty little secret is without the defense, and casillas, they don’t win the euros, they don’t win the world cup. He covers up everything, you think spain would win with valdez? Palop? De Gea? Reina? Forget it.

    Italians are training with oxygen masks to get them in shape in time. We need to use all available resources

    and most important we need a tactical genius. Bert Van Marwijk might be great at first plans, But in game decisions, he’s not very good, where as del bosque is. Look at what he did to us, he saw that van bronkhorst played tight, he brought on jesus navas, to bring speed that opened us up.

    What kind of coach we need?

    a tactical genius

    Whats the most important aspect of tactics?

    Player Selection to beat the opponent (s). So we need to select not only our best players, but the best players who can perform their job in the team. So it’s important that we the fans keep a sharp eye, on what each of the coaching candidates have done in the past, what formations they used, and what players they selected to see.

  11. I wish this new Oranje playing 4-3-3 or 4-4-2. I am tired of seeing 4-2-3-1 and how slow our build up play. 4-2-3-1 is more for defend and counter attack. Younger players should have energy to move up and down the field. They need to understand position and space and move. A good coach can make this happen. Look at Italy. Somehow he can manage Balotelli while Blanc failed to manage Nasri. With 4-4-2 we still have a chance to pair Huntelaar and Van Persie.
    Your thoughts?

  12. One more question. Does anyone know when KNVB set a deadline or expectation to have a coach in place? 45 – 50 days to the next game is not much time. Perhaps they put Cocu in charge if they cannot find a coach…

  13. It would be funny if KNVB are shitting their pants because no one wants this job. Perhaps they are thinking maybe we should not ask Bert to resign…Now we are even in worse condition…

    1. how long did it take for knvb to hire bert van marwijk when van basten left.

      for all we know, they could be talking about contract terms, and what kind of style of play the new coach wants.

      We don’t know, i would hope they have a list, and have done interviews, at least on the phone, and are getting ready to have a personal interview, no one can spy at the headquarters and watch who enters and leaves

        1. That’s true. I remember when I was taking my seat at the KNVB Beker at de Kuip in 1998 that my Dutch host informed me that after the match van Marwijk was going to take over at Oranje.

        2. alright, so it didn’t take long, so now we gotta wait and see?

          what if they bring in a caretaker manager for a short while? who would they pick, if they don’t get the perfect candidate.

  14. A reoccurring line here is “control the players egos”. I’ve said it many times myself so not pointing any fingers. But in the development of a player maybe they should teach tact and personal responsibility.

    Why the hell does a coach need to control a players ego? A world class player should have the pride and most importantly desire to be a champion. I understand not every player has that mentality and some need to be mentored (like Balotelli).

    Whoever the next manager is he needs to be…
    1. Consistent
    2. Explain his vision and methods and then STICK TO THEM
    3. Pick the best possible TEAM (balanced/versatile players) to suit the style/formation

    After that it’s up to the players to play their heart out. Playing well leads to confidence which leads to wins.

    1. yes totally agree i’m not so worried about the egos.

      if arjen robben is playing great for bayern munich, then he should play for holland. NO doubt.

      I could care less if it’s true about afellay’s attitude in private, Fact is dude had no business being on the field.

      and same with huntelaar, even if it’s true all the stuff he was saying and doing. ON the field, where it matters, He got no service, and still made runs to pull defenders away and open up shooting lanes, Just watch what he did on the goal against portugal and goal vs germany.

      What happens on the field matters the most.

      as long as players take the games seriously and don’t party and crap. then it’s all good. best team, best players for that team.

  16. this line struck me the most:

    “Van Marwijk led the Netherlands to the World Cup final in 2010 and qualified with ease for major tournaments on two occasions. His record as national manager is impressive, winning on 34 occasions in his 52 games in charge, suffering defeat on just eight occasions. He used 56 players in his tenure and gave debuts to 26 players.”

    That is amazing not to mention #1 on the Fifa chart. The pragmatic approach backfired at the wrong time and made us look ugly in the process…. however, it must be said that our defenses weaknesses were masked and unless we have able replacements we will sink further in the tunnel of gloom.

    1. i don’t know, at the time in 2010, mathijsen was a really great defender, he man marked david villa out of the game, to the point his only good chance was a bad clearance by heitinga that fell to him. mathijsen was really good. and He was very healthy, not missing any games.

      But this year at malaga, has been very bad. Injury wise, fitness wise, and he only started to play great when they changed his defensive partner to nacho monreal, him and demechellis would visibily be arguing on the field.

      and the gave debuts to 26 players? is way too high, lets not forget a month after the world cup, we played a friendly against ukraine, where guys like roy beerens, van wolfswinkel, marcellis, theo janssen, wout brama amongst others got to play as a one time thing, and then before the tournament let some guys try out but never seriously challenge. I mean vurnon anita only played three times for holland, i remember the world cup game before mexico, he wasn’t ready, then when??? ukraine game afterward, and then the third time? before the euros, when he was ready. and showed us he was great?

      Only new players he tried that are starters are erik pieters (forced change van bronkhorst retired) and Gregory Van der Wiel

      Everyone else on the starting squad was used, and/or around during van basten’s time. . thats not much change

      he didn’t first start the 4-2-3-1, van basten did, and he played van bommel instead of engelaar for the reasons we know. and ooijer was to the bench, and van der wiel took over boulah,

      and ruud van nistelrooy retired internationally, so he put van persie there, robben for van der vaart, and what we have? almost same team. different players.

    2. @ Bitterballen;
      I tend to agree with you on van Marwijk. I truly think that as time passes, we will look back at the van Marwijk era with fondness. I do not think the next two years will progress with a triumphant return of “Totaal Voetbal”, and that we ride imperiously into Brasil and lift the Cup. I do think we have immense talent (as always), but the age old dilemma with Dutch Football will arise.

      1) A National identity which is not fostered or implented at the foreign clubs where most of our players play, and them is demanded for the 2 months a year our team comes together. There will be a lack of cohesion.

      2) This leads to “poor” results. Like a series of drab one goal wins or close draws which leave us in always very “Dutch” qualifying conundrum of barely squeaking through to major tournaments regardless of the Group we are drawn into. This of course leads to…

      3) Pressure and self doubt within the ranks which invariably leads to bickering and self-assumed importance on the part of several “important players”.

      If there is one great positive I gleaned from watching van Marwijk, it was his machine like approach to the qualifiers. Very little stress or drama.

  17. Unless the new manager is able to do what BVM cannot do, then he’s worth it. If not, then might as well stick with Bert for consistency, since Bert knows exactly what to modify now.

  18. Spain might be the only team to win EC-WC-EC if they beat Italy. If they do so they will go down in history as one of the best teams of all time and they hardly beat us 2 years ago so chill out guys!!!.

    Of course we need some changes especially in defence and midfield but apart from that we are not that bad. Yes we sucked in EC 2012 but I think it was more about lack of mentality, team fighting and our weak defence.

    I see a good future with the mix of youngsters like Classie, Fer, Wijnaldum, Strootman with the experience of Sneijder, Robben, Afellay…

  20. The KNVB have been very stupid to let BvM go if the main alternative is now Gullit. He has failed at pretty much every club he’s managed, rarely shown any loyalty or commitment (eg carried on living in Holland when managing Newcastle, where he also clashed with Shearer, another dick), and let’s not forget he walked away from Oranje in ’94 and he was part of our most disastrous campaign of all in ’90.
    I am totally against a foreign coach as well. I think that would damage Holland’s reputation.
    Is Cruijff compus mentus enough and healthy enough to do it ?
    Ideally we need a younger man with the vision to bring on board the successful players from the U’17 and U’21 squads over the next few years.
    Maybe we should be asking BvM to reconsider……..

    1. Excellent points on Gullit. He comes off as a greatly talented kid, who also has “too fun” approach.

      Though at one time Cruijff would have been the ideal choice, several things will not allow his assuming the leadership role.

      1) His wife Danny.
      2) His age, insofar as he considers his age.
      3) He likes his role as the uninvolved “sage on the mountain top”. He enjoys being able to swoop in, deliver constructive (or destructive) criticism, and then fly away as we all sit and marvel at his genius.

      It works for him and he is allowed to foster his legendary status (deserved I will admit) without any results tarnishing his status.
      But I do admit I would love to see him give it a go. But the K.N.V.B. do not like Cruijff. For all that he has brought to Dutch football, they still don’t like him.

  21. I know a lot of people have there reservations about van Gaal and I totally understand why but I wouldn’t mind if he got a second shot. We have a lot of young players who may be ready to come through and despite all of his faults on thing van Gaal is good at is giving younger players oppurtunities and entrusting them. Whatever you say about the man you can’t knock that.

    Bert was too rigid to work / succeed with younger players. Look at Bayern now, van Gaal gave many of those players a chance, Gustavo, Alaba, Muller, Kroos. Ok some where already on their way to stardom and some did not fair so well but Bayern are still reaping some rewards for van Gaals stay a few years ago (after a few years in the dulldrums) no matter how turbulent his stay was!

  22. I think Foppe de haan should take the job .
    He is a Great tactitian , never coached Oranje before “jong Oranje only ” , tries many formations till he decides the best one , plays beautiful football , can deal with young players and egos and he is a winner .

    Knvb must convince him to take the job .

    1. The best option for me is , and will alwyas be , Johan Cryuff .

      Co adrianse is a good option , but i think he needs another wise assistant aside with him , as he seems like a kinda crazy man , lol .

      How about Verbeek ? he plays classic dutch football with AZ , but i don’t know much about him .

  23. Gullit? Did you actually see the complete fucking shambles he created in his short time at Newcastle? Did you listen to those post match interviews – mostly after defeats?
    The guy hasn’t the first clue about the sport – ‘sexy football’ hahahahaha.
    He can play a game or two, sure, can’t we all, but my god he’s genuinely one of the most inept and strategically ignorant managers I have ever witnessed in senior football.
    His regular column in ‘Sportsmail’ sends shudders down my spine – it’s naive in the extreme – painful in its simplicity and general incorrectness.
    I genuinely cannot believe any of you people would want him anywhere near the National team. Are we not enough of a joke already? Truly. You’re just pulling names out of your arseholes now for the sake of it. Think. Then type. Surely.

    Also, as far as I am aware the only managers to ‘rule themselves out’ did so while Bert was still in charge – clearly the right/respectful thing to do at the time.

    Adriaanse
    De Boer
    Rijkaard
    Hiddink
    De Haan

    All decent suggestions.

    And where is Van Basten while all this is going on?
    I want Marco back, and I want him to take tactical instruction from Cruyff.

    1. van basten is at herenveen coaching there,

      and yes guillit is openly asking to be coach.

      I think just because KNVB is quiet doesn’t mean they aren’t looking, i’m sure they’ve called a few candidates, have a list.

      for all we know, they can be talking contract terms with someone right now! and we don’t even know.

    2. @Boss, don’t get your panties in a bunch, he was only ever mentioned as a front with a broad and experienced staff to do most of the technical work.

      Besides Hiddink, Rijkaard, V.Basten, De Haan and De Boer arent available and Adriaanse is not a credible answer, too old, not gonna work.

  24. If it comes between Gullit and Van Gaal, please let it be Van Gaal. At least he seems to understand something about the game on a tactical level. Maybe he has learned from his past mistakes…

      1. that can only mean the coach they want is under contract with someone. if a coach is available and they want him, they will have them no problem. van gaal, co adriaanse would have been hired.

        So i’m guessing if it’s gonna take a while, it’s rijkaard, or verbeek, or someone who is already a coach of a team.

  27. BVM did a good job of picking players, managing egos and building team spirit for WC2010, but it ALL went wrong over the last year. The new coach needs to try some of the younger talent, and make sure that everyone knows that prima donna behavior will not tolerated. There is talent, but player/personnel decisions are crucial–and building chemistry on and off the field.

  28. Of course rijkaard is staying at saudi arabia, i looked at the details, 15.9 million for 3 years, thats 5 million a year.

    Pretty good terms. And we thought hiddink was expensive, how much did bert van marwijk get paid?

    1. Thats a good point, will Rijkaard be willing to give up 80% of his salary?

      Cruijjff today said he prefers Rijkaard, able to change and knows the top. Cruff was also lyrical about Prandelli!
      (Not to be dutch coach but for the way he makes his team a unit)

      1. like i was checking the salaries of coaches, Joachim low gets paid around 3 1/2 million,

        Louis van gaal was getting paid 8 million

        mourinho 14 million

        rijkaard was 5 million

        bert van marwijk got 2 1/2 million

        and guus hiddink was 11 million

        pep guardiola makes 10 million

        now that we have actual figures, we can see the next coach will possibly be an eredivisie coach, money wise, since it seems the van oostveen talks about the performance affecting money.

        money wise who can take the job? I don’t know the pay of eredivisie coaches, but i heard something like average 110,000 euros, so why would a coach not want to take the holland job, even if they make half of what bert did, thats a million more than what they were making previously.

        Who knows, all i do know is, i’m expecting someone whos coaching a team now. And will leave his club.

  29. I think Holland is a great football nation. It should be easy for Holland to find a new manager for national team. And you have a lot of talented footballers, so I am pretty sure that you will be one of favorites to win world cup 2014.

    The only thing you need to fix is about how to defend collectively, like what Italy did, everyone is defender! Defending is starting from the strikers….

  37. Switching to another country, Blanc just resigned and Didier Deschamps is the front-runner to take over. This looks like a rather smooth transition. Too bad FdB is pretty much out of the running otherwise he’ll coach against former players he used to play against.

  38. The Netherlands is a comparatively small country, which is one of the reasons the world of soccer respects its development of players who reach world-class status and contribute significantly to many major teams, especially those in Europe and the British Isles. The Dutch also have made an extraordinary contribution to the teaching and coaching of the sport, and are recognized around the world for that talent.

    What the Netherlands has not been known for is an ability to win major international tournaments. That is not hard to understand, for the reasons stated above–size of country, pool of talent to draw from, cultural approaches to athletic competition and (my view) the development of gifted coaches who command respect for their talent, maintain control of team and players and are allowed to develop programs over a long term. For a small country, 3 second place finishes in the World Cup is a remarkable record. There is no other small country with that accomplishment. 1 Euro–same as small country Denmark–also unique, but not as much as the WC results.

    The most remarkable aspect of Dutch football for me, however, is the number of tournaments they could have/should have(?) won. I can argue that they could have won as many as 4 or 5 Euro championships, and 1 or 2 WCs in addition to the 3 they almost won. The talent was there, the coaching seemed to be there, but somehow the results did not occur. However, everybody always said that the Dutch were fun to watch, played attractive and exciting football with obvious skill and team play. Cruijff always argues that people talk more about the Dutch than the Germans in WC ’74, even though the trophy did not come home to the Netherlands. David Winner, in his wonderful book about Dutch football, suggests that the Dutch care (cared?) more about skillful, attractive football than in winning tournaments. It is hard to debate that conclusion.

    For these reasons, I think we all are very disappointed about Euro ’12. We were not talented enough to win it. We did not play skillful, attractive football. There seemed to be no leadership on of off the field, and the players seemed not to care so much about the results. This is what is new about now, and how the Dutch go about addressing these issues will be interesting.

    Unlike others on this blog, I do not believe that the Dutch currently have the level of skill and talent of former national teams. I also believe that BvM was not at the same level as “our” prior coaches. So, what appears to be needed is a complete overhaul of Dutch football, including the development of new talent, an agreement on Dutch tactics and style and a search for a coach that can help put this all together. This does not appear to be something which can be fixed quickly, which is all right because the Netherlands does not have 60,000 or 80,000 people to choose from in finding required replacements to current personnel.

    JC said several years ago that what just happened was probably going to happen, for the reasons stated. The Dutch do not have an unlimited talent pool, and great teaching can not make a mid-level athlete into an elite one. In ’74, ’78, ’88 and ’98, we were filled with elite athletes. Even in ’10, and certainly now, the percentage of truly world class players was not at the level of these former teams. Can these issues be addressed? Maybe. But many changes will be required, and the Dutch like to debate even the color of the sky, so these fixes will need skill and patience to achieve. My hope is a return to excellence, but I am one who first wants to see the Dutch return to attractive, skillful football. The wins will come along, if they can achieve that goal. Professional sports are, in fact, a form of entertainment and the Dutch in the past have been great entertainers. May those days return.

  39. Very nice read Bob and good insight into the dutch psyche..

    After our departure from th euro most dutch fansites transpire a wish and a longing for a return to attractive football, rather than prices. Most people say they dont care for berts´ football and have no good memories at ´10, whereas with Marco 4 yr ago our games against Italy and France were unforgettable. Maybe we are peculiar that we want esthetics over results but its what makes us typical. Bert tried to change that culture, he denied our dutch football dna and that could never end well.

    I hear there is a big discussion/soul searching in germany right now to end the ´beautiful dutch approach with which they win nothing´ and go back to the old german power house style which got them medals.
    Here in hollland we want to get rid of Bert and his concrete football and want to retrun to our roots, style, technique, position, attack, wingplay.

  40. When managers are saying no as quickly as the speed of light (Hiddink, Rijkaard, Koeman, Frank de Boer) then there is something wrong about this squad and the environment surrounding them. I can bet you that these managers get the inside scoop more than we do.
    I hope that this serves as a VERY valuable lesson to these players, half hearted players should just resign and focus on their personal and money making careers. Indirectly this is saying a lot about the current players, if they still don’t get the message then no wonder they lost 3 in a row….
    And for those still bashing on Van Marwijk, stop it dude he was brave enough to take the first hit and resign. He may lack leadership but tops in terms of accountability..

  41. I think Bob summed it up really well. I personally feel “it’s not whether you win or lose but how you play the game” to add to what Cruyff says. Everyone remembers 74′ for Total Football. Only Germans hold their victory higher. Aside from Chelsea fans nobody else (maybe Bayern for losing) will remember their victory. It was total anti-football.

    It’s very rare that beautiful football meets trophy glory. The few exceptions are Ajax of the 70’s/90’s, Barcelona the last 5 years and Spain the last 3 tournaments. BvM wanted to try something new and bring some trophies to Nederland by trading style for “tournament-tactics”. It was admirable and he came close but in the end we didn’t win anything and we went from bad to worse.

    The Dutch are already successful for all their contributions and influence in football which I think outweighs Brazil’s 5 WC. Nobody is trying to play “Brazilian football”. We should go back to beautiful football. With the right group of players and a little luck we will win trophies. Spain just won their first world cup and they have a rich history and tradition in football. We will win too… just a matter of time.

  42. Jan, why don’t you run a poll and see what the fans really want?

    1. pretty football and lose all the time
    2. title football and better chances at WK

    I am curious to see what the majority really wants …

    and please don’t add an option

    3. total football and lots of titles 🙂 🙂

    cause it’s not going to happen !

  43. Out of curiosity, where is Jaap Stam right now? cocu, de boer, bergkamp, kluivert have all gone into coaching but i don’t hear anything about Stam. I like stam’s mentality and i think he’s got the goods to be a good manager in the future…

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