A bit of a shocker: the Queen yawning when presented with the Dutch squad in 2010

Bert van Marwijk coached us to the WC finals in 2010. And now he’s gone… Never before did Oranje perform as well as under Bert van Marwijk. We’ll say goodbye using five historic games…

Holland – Brazil 2-1, July 2, 2010
Quarter finals of the World Cup. Holland hadn’t really shown up on many radars. Winning against Denmark and Japan is not really something “remarkable”. The Brazil game was a crazy game. Brazil was bossing Holland aound in the first half. In the second half, Oranje gets back into the game, based on mental strength. Nigel de Jong: “We outplayed them on passion and through a couple of little smart things.” Holland is a strong collective and demonstrates a winning mentality. This game is seen as the high point with Bert as big inspiration and motivator. After this game, Bert says: “There is a big difference between someone saying that he wants it, or someone actually demonstrating that he wants it. A big difference between belief and real belief!”. Bert helped the players believe in it. In 35 minutes, Oranje did everything right. Even good football returned. And playing to your strength. And having confidence. And be ballsy. After this game, Oranje was unbeaten for 24 games. A record! And the world looked up… Oranje? Again?

Holland-Spain 0-1, WC-finals, 11 July 2010
32 years after the last World Cup final Holland is at the highest level again. A tremendous performance by Van Marwijk and the team. Arjen Robben had the winner on his shoe in the 61-st minute and could have written history for the Dutch, but he didn’t. Oranje was prone to dirty play and Spain was a tad better. Holland capitulated in the 116th minute. After the hangover, pride and surprise reigned and Amsterdam filled up with a million fans. Bert van Marwijk entered the realm of Great Coaches (move over Rinus, Ernst and Guus….).

Nederland-San Marino 11-0, 2 september 2011
In September 2011, Holland takes the number one spot for national teams in the FIFA ranking for the first time ever. Despite the lost World Cup finals, Holland is the best team of the world. This honorary title is being celebrated with an 11-0 win over San Marino and Holland is the leader of its qualification group. This could well be the high point of the Van Marwijk era. The papers call it the “appetite of a insatiable team….”

Germany – Holland 3-0, 15 November 2011
Two months later, it’s all different. Some Dutch internationals are having issues. They are injured or benched or out of form. The EC qualification is no problemo, but the Clockwork Orange is starting to choke. First a loss against Sweden, than this friendly against Germany. It’s a horrible game. The national papers call it the “worst game under Van Marwijk. No passion, no quality, no discipline. No nothing, really.” There were some players absent, but the level of the Dutch defence was “shocking”. And the national papers start to focus in on the age of some players: Kuyt, Mathijsen, Van Bommel… They are all well above 30 and aren’t getting better. And apart from Strootman and Afellay, Van Marwijk failed to find new blood for his team.

Holland-Germany 1-2, EC 2012, 13 June 2012
The Denmark defeat at the EC could still be regarded as a freak loss. Two years before, Denmark didn’t get into the game, and Holland had an easy victory. Now, Denmark scored and Holland simply couldn’t convert any of the chances. The deception came against Germany. Holland had a good 10 minutes but lost stamina quickly. The Germans made the Dutch defence look like amateurs and Gomez didn’t even cheer after his second goal. The ultimate humiliation was the comments by the Germans to “do their duty to give Holland a lifeline”. The national papers: “Holland lacked chemistry, strikers, defence and midfield. The team went down under stress and impotence.” Van Marwijk’s magic was over. And it was practically the same team that reached the World Cup finals. Was this Euro performance a disaster? Or was Holland’s performance in South Africa a rarity?

We will find the answers in the coming months and years…

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0 responses to “Bert van Marwijk's career in 5 matches”

  1. Demi says:

    Let’s look at the bright side only:

    1. 3 years of an unbeatable Orange machine, a true Naranja Mecanica 🙂

    2. Trashing Brazil for the first time since 1974 (the only two games that Brazil has ever become a laughing stock in its history)

    3. Stekelenburg saving Kaka, saving the day, saving the tournament, saving an entire nation 🙂

    4. Played in a world cup semifinal where everyone including Uruguay knew the result before the game even started. How many teams can claim such thing?

    5. Outplayed Spain for the 90′ of the regular time (we slightly disagree on this Jan).

    6. Came a freaking hair from winning the World Cup, maybe even closer than 78.

    What’s not to like? Bert’s machine was out of this world. Total domination just like in the 70s.

    Most of you never lived the 70s. You can not imagine our opponents feeling like they have lost the game before the game even started. Bert brought that back.

    Like everything, it came to an end. Cruyff’s machine didn’t last more than 3 years either.

    thank you Jan

  2. Demi says:

    BTW, you got “More Beer” from me (via my girls Paypal account, didnt want to setup mine for now)

    Proost!

    🙂 🙂 🙂

  3. Hien says:

    Enjoy your beer Jan! I like the game vs Sweden in qualification (the game that Oranje won). That game could change many things….

  4. Hien says:

    Demi, it is good to have that winning feeling although we did not win the most important game. I wished that Oranje play a more attractive football (want), but I care more about winning/confidence attitude, the mental toughness that we use to lack (need). The need is more important than the want.

    • Demi says:

      The best comparable example I can bring is Brazil. They won after 24 years playing title football just like we did. Then they came back with a more relaxed style in 98 and finally they won the 2002 with very very attractive football.

      It is very hard to break dry spells. Imagine Brazil with its huge population and the immense talent and tradition had to resort to “Bert tactics” to win their first one after 24 years.

      That is the proven way of crawling back. Realistic approach until you establish domination. Then, trust me, we are Dutch. We will win one playing with flair. But first we need to win one , by all means available.

      If the 98 team had used Bert tactics (used at that time by France BTW), they would have won it hands down.

      • Guillaume vB says:

        Good lord, I am happy the 98 Oranje team did not play like those ugly, mean, uninspired (besides Zidane) bastards of France 98. I still hate them to the day.

        • ferenc says:

          exactly. after all,oranje didn’t win more with title football than with dominant football,but lost much more: prestige,fans,etc.
          i would have hated watching f. de boer,overmars,cocu,kluivert,davids,seedorf,bergkamp,etc. pkaying the way bert’s men did. bert didn’t have any other choice,his squad was far away in quality from the 98 squad. playing title football with the 98-2000 genweration is like if pep guardiola would have chosen catenaccio with his barca.

  5. Hien says:

    Agreed about that 98 team. I think the 1998 and 2000 teams have a very good chance had they made it to the final. The sad part we wasted our chance. The difference between Brazil 94 and Oranje is Brazil had Romario who could score any possible way and Dunga was a good leader and most importantly they practiced penalty well. They are practical, realistic and no-nonsense in their approach.

    • JK says:

      I think the difference was Branco

      • Demi says:

        Huge player. But the entire Brazil 94 squad was underrated. Yes, they were not fancy but they had a machine line determinism in their game.

        As per our 98 team, our nation was not ready yet to accept title football. They still wanted to win the cup playing total football. We had great defenders but not so great defense 🙂 I don’t think we could beat France and their no nonsense approach.

        Hiddink was not afforded in 98 what Bert was afforded in 2010. That is why I would like to see Guus one more time, now that they will remove the “total football” constraint.

        It is very hard to win the WK. It takes all kinds of things including luck we never had. If you add the clause “you got to play total football” you just make it impossible.

        Spain didn’t play any better than we did in 2010. They had a good semi with Germany (foolish team). But they almost lost from Paraguay (would have been a fair result) and they almost didn’t make it out of the group.

        • Rich says:

          Just to refresh your memory, Spain is playing “total football”. They have ingrained in there system ever since the creator himself Mr Cruyf installed it into the youth programs and in Barcelona.

          They took are style and perfected it. We don’t need to develop an ugly style of football that doesn’t utilise are talented players.

          I don’t want to see Holland play like italy and Greece. Wining ugly!

      • Ilir says:

        The difference was the referee for giving that attracious free kick that should have been awarded to Netherlands, since Branca slapped Overmars.

        • Erich says:

          @Ilir: EXACTLY!!!!!!!!! I still can’t believe the referee was the only guy in the whole stadium not to see Branco slapping Overmars’ face before!!
          Oh, that was SO frustrating! Had not been for that mistake… who would have stopped the Oranje to go pick the trophy?
          I remember Advocaat wasn’t that bad of a coach, but choosing the old Wouters over F. De Boer for that specific match proved not to be the best decision. Still, the whole team was exceptionally well balanced, with the only exception of De Goeij. Goalkeepers have always been the problem!

          Remember the boys back then?
          _____________ __De Goeij________________
          ____Valckx____R. Koeman____F. De Boer___
          __Rijkaard__Jonk__Winter__Rob Witschge__
          ______Roy____Bergkamp____Overmars_______

          Now which one of today’s players would have found space between that generation of players to actually play a match? Yes. Probably none. And that gets worse if we turn our memory back to 1988.

          Anyway, I have faith in Van Gaal although the generation of players isn’t the usual quality. Sneijder being the exeption.
          Still,…
          HUP HOLLAND HUP!!!!!!!!!

          • Ilir says:

            @ Erich – …and the linesman. The second Brazil goal was a mile offside, and the same linesman was picked for the final, and he was Palestinian and they don’t even have a League!!!!!!!!! It was Havelange’s last year at helm of FIFA so he had to give it to Brazil. In the final against Italy the same linesman never raised the flag and there were two flagrant offsides that were given by the ref Puhl.
            ..and if Gullit wouldn’t have pulled out. The story of us, with so many ifs.

  6. SamDC says:

    Sad memories but at least we got good results leading up to the finals. If only Robben had scored against Casillas, all our conversations would have been different.

    A lot of uncertainties surrounding the team right now. Lets hope for the best and take it game by game.

    • Ilir says:

      I’m sure Webb would have given Spain a penalty as soon as someone dropped inside the box, had Robben scored that one. I can’t forget the media crusade against the Dutch prior to the game. The fate of Dutch no matter what was sealed before the kicking start.

      • SamNY says:

        Agreed. I think the red card to Heitinga was totally undeserved and it was the way Howard gifted the game to the spanish, by an iniesta dive… the guy that scored the winning goal.

  7. Miguel Rosado says:

    Elia to Bremen is fantastic news!. I really hope he gets back to his top form and if he does so he’ll make the national team.

  8. Miguel Rosado says:

    We must be very aware of our rivals because we don’t have a very easy group.

    We start against Turkey and that game is very important. Romania is also good. I think we will qualify but our players have to give it their all from the very beginning.

  9. Miguel Rosado says:

    The big issue is our center backs. We need strong center backs with good positioning and who can actually start the game from the back.

    Our left back spot is well covered Pieters, Van Aanholt, Emanuelson, Willems, Blind, Anita, Zuiverloon?, etc…

  10. Miguel Rosado says:

    Good news: Chelsea defender Patrick van Aanholt has re-joined Vitesse on loan for the 2012-13 season.

    I see many players going back to basics in order to restart their careers and that’s great news.

  11. OranjeBoom says:

    Elia will be Marko Marin’s replacement and I really hope he is in the starting 11 and has a great season.

  12. Hien says:

    Yes, a good coach will prepare the team to win one game at a time. This is something I am afraid Van Gaal may not do. I hope he does not look at the whole picture and forget the tiny details in between. We cannot go into a game and think we have 10 more games to make it right. We can only take it game by game for now. Win this game now. You have time to prepare for the next opponent after the game.

  13. Bob says:

    Jan, I am wondering if this blog is a spoof on us–“van Marwyck as greatest coach”—“move over Rinus Michels…” Perhaps you were just parroting what was being said and written then, and what is being said and written now. I would suggest that the old saying still applies, that “you can’t make a silk purse out of a sow’s ear.” The Dutch succeeded against inferior competition, played over their head in the WC and then lost to a Spanish team which played, for them, a terrible game caused in part by the “new”, van Marwyck-created muscle headed play of Holland. Did I want them to win–yes! But I did not cry when they lost, and I believe that even if they had won, Euro ’12 would have had the same results. I stand by my comment in an earlier blog, that the WC was the aberration. Holland’s talent and coaching skills put them in the top 30 in the world, but they do not win against quality opponents when the pressure is on.

    I absolutely agree with your comments at the end of your blog, that we will continue to support the team, hope for van Gaal to be successful and hopefully with the result that the Netherlands national team will restore itself to respectability on the world stage. Much will need to change for all of this to happen, but I will be watching, and of course, reading your very excellent comments.

    • Bitterballen says:

      they beat brazil and uruguay, 2 top teams.. when it mattered! i dunno they seemed entitled to winning in 2010, they hadn’t looked that hungry in years!

  14. Hien says:

    My ranking of Dutch coaches(not necessarily only national team coach)
    1. Rinus Michels
    2. Johan Cruyff
    3. Bert Van Marwijk and Ernst Happel
    5. Guus Hiddink
    6. Frank Rijkaard
    7. Louis Van Gaal
    The General is still no. 1.

  15. Bitterballen says:

    so sad!

  16. Jan says:

    Ha Bob, I didn’t intend to say that Bert is above Rinus :-). The “move-over” suggested that, I know. But it is more “make place on the bench for Bert”. The results suggest that Bert is the most successful coach for us. Based on wins. I wouldn’t place Bert in the same league as Rinus and Ernst tactically…

  17. Hien says:

    Jan, the bottom line is only Rinus won the only title. Stolen or not, Oranje should not have any excuse given the talents this country has. It should be about winning the final, including all the matches leading to it. No more excuse (that’s what my colleagues used to tell me, Oranje fans blame on this and blame on that). All I need is the team play well enough to qualify, then well enough to get past the first round, win elimination games and go on to win final. I do not care if we lose friendlies or ranking number 10. Like Demi said, win 1 WC first then you can do whatever you want. Oranje should win 1 WC minimum. Bert had a good record but he failed in the final and like the rest, no title. Had we won in 2010, perhaps Bert is tied with Rinus (in my ranking).

  18. Verseus says:

    Hi guys,

    A bit off topic, but what does everyone think about Jonathan De Guzman signing for Swansea on loan? He had a terrible season with Villareal last year, but I am hopeful that Swansea will bring out the best in him, especially as Laudrup is coaching (he coached JDG in his best season at Mallorca) and Swansea need a replacement for Gylfi Sigurdsson.

    Thoughts?

    • eduardo says:

      i don’t know. i think he isn’t so talented as we thought he was.

      i don’t understand some moves, like Bakkal to Dynamo Moscu or Assidi to Galastasaray. i think this guys made bad decisions.

      • Jan says:

        Bakkal is seen as a mediocre midfielder. He is 26 years old and has signed for 4 years in Moscow. This deal will make him very wealthy. He’d never be able to get a better deal than Freiburg, or West Brom or Majorca….

        • Eduardo says:

          yes but Assaidi has a lot fo potential!

        • Alex says:

          De Guzman is very talented but Villareal’s team had a horrible season. He’s just not the type of player that steals the show every week. More of a Xabi Alonso type, he does his work with good technique and pops up in the box every now and again. Unlike X.Alonso though, De Guzman never found a top team where he could settle and be appreciated, Real Mallorca and Villareal were mediocre teams but that doesnt disqualify De Guzman. He still has pinpoint technique. Bakkal is mediocre indeed.

  19. SamDC says:

    My biggest fear with van Gaal is that he will start cutting star players just to show how tough he is. I know some of you guys are happy to see that but I just feel that we don’t have quality and proven replacements at some positions. We may have to go into complete rebuilding mode instead of fixing the issues that plagued this team.

    My point is that he’ll be too fast in his changes which could be very risky. He’ll do things not because it’s absolutely necessary but just for the sake of doing things. I doubt he has the patience and support that some players need to improve or gain more confidence.

    • Rich says:

      I agree! IMO, Holland will never win until there coaches start treating there players as equals or experts.

      Its one thing to see what’s needed from the sidelines and another when your on the field. These players are the soldiers and the General has to listen to the players as they have to listen to him also.

      Holland has more then enough talent and style of football to win many times over through the years. There something missing and my instincts tell me it comes from the power struggle between both players and coaches. But I would more blame on the coaches..

  20. eduardo says:

    it’s seems that Moisander wants to play in Ajax.

    Ajax is looking for a replace for Vertonghen, in this order: Moisander, Nuytinck in first place, and on second Viergiver, Donk or Douglas.

    in order to orange interest, i want that Ajax sings Viergiver, Nuytinck or Donk. it will be nice for these players to develop in Ajax.
    I don’t want Moisander takes this guys the chance to play for Ajax.

    Douglas can try in another league.

  21. futbol says:

    All righty. Below is the fixture for Netherlands’ WC2014 Qualifying:

    Date Matches
    07/09/12 Netherlands – Turkey
    11/09/12 Hungary – Netherlands
    12/10/12 Netherlands – Andorra
    16/10/12 Romania – Netherlands
    22/03/13 Netherlands – Estonia
    26/03/13 Netherlands – Romania
    06/09/13 Estonia – Netherlands
    10/09/13 Andorra – Netherlands
    11/10/13 Netherlands – Hungary
    15/10/13 Turkey – Netherlands

    • Jan says:

      Thanks! I will use that if that is ok 🙂

    • JK says:

      Turkey, Romania and hungary (in that order) are the main challenger of holland in this group. If Holland gets a few ties especially in the away games it might just come to knocking out andorra 11 to nothing.
      The turks are quite unpredictable as a team. They can be beaten but sometimes they might be very good. The romanians are kind of like the bulgarians. They will try and play the same game the Bulgarian coach did when they beat us before the Euros. Hungary is better than they were 2 years ago, so watch out.

      to be honest, if holland plays with the same spirit of Euro2012, they could lose most of their matches. Much depends on club form and injuries here, so we shall see. I strongly believe that if we win the first game vs turkey, that shall give us confidence for the rest of the campaign.

  22. futbol says:

    @Jan
    You’re always welcome. The fixture I posted is from FIFA official website.

  23. Jad says:

    I still dont understand why Van Gaal is assigned to this Job, he has his chances before, what he is going to add to the team!!!!, what he is going to do !!!

    For any failure, KNVB has to be blamed and not the coach, KNVB board has to quit.

    Its weird, how Cruyff advises are taken into consideration in many countries, and in his own country they don’t…

    The only reason why Oranje is failing i think is because of Management on high levels,strategy and plans…

  24. Bob says:

    Futbol has posted the 10 matches which will determine if Holland qualifies for WC ’14. Once again, and gratefully so, we have an easy road to (this time) Brazil. If van Gaal is smart, and I think he is, he should schedule several friendlies with top quality teams, to test the waters on new talent, tactics and whatever else he will try to accomplish. One of the long standing characteristics of the Dutch national team is to play up or down to the level of the opponent. That has never been a good habit, and I believe that van Gaal will try to change it.

    • Demi says:

      >one of the long standing characteristics of the Dutch national team is to play up or down to the level of the opponent. That has never been a good habit

      with all due respect, I think that Bert already changed that quite a bit. in your critique of Bert and this team, I don’t think you recognize the fact that he made an easy meal of some “Danemarks” and some “Swedens” for almost 3 years in a row.

      You spoke of a positive aberration during the WK2010 but how about the 3 years “aberration” of bulldozing any conceivable opponent? Wasn’t that a first time since the 70s thing?

      You are correct that we haven been slackers against mediocre opponents and got bad results too. For 30 something years some “Irelands” gave us trouble. Didn’t Bert fix that already though?

  25. Eduardo says:

    I think we should recognise that Van Gaal has huge football knowledge and a lot of credit. Yes he is capable to do the best (Ajax 94, Barca) or the worst (Orange 2002)
    Yes, he failed before, but that don´t mean that he will do it again.

    Churchill failed in Gallipoli battle, one of the worst Britain defeat on the history, and was demoted from First Lord of the Admiralty. But 25 years later, he become Prime Minister and was the main man on Hitler´s defeat. Also was very strange man.

    I am not saying that Van Gaal is like Churchill (illogical comparison). My point is, sometimes the people learn from their mistakes, sometimes, seconds chances aren´t bad idea. We can find a lot of examples in history and football where de seconds chances brought bad results (Van Gaal 2 on Barcelona), but also where seconds chances brought good ones (Michels 2 in Orange, but this not apply because Michels did great in his first chance).

    I had wished that Rikjaard become our coach (he did it very well the first time), but if the KNBV choose Van Gaal, I am not pessimist as if they had chosen Advocaat or Sven Goran Eriksoon. In fact I prefer Van Gaal over Gullit, Koeman or Rutten. At least we all know that Van Gaal has the potential and the knowledge to do a wonderful job.

  26. Miguel Rosado says:

    I actually think the KNVB is doing an OK job. I mean they were the ones who gave Bert the job and he almost won the whole thing.

    They learned from their mistakes about giving the job to an inexperienced coach (Van Basten) and wanted someone with real experience.

    Louis is a controversial coach but he can give our players the mentality needed to succeed.

    • ferenc says:

      Miguel: this inexperimented coach (marco) had far better results with the national team than van gaal and his squads were not as great as the bunch of players van gaal had between 2000 and 2002.

      • JK says:

        not to mention that it was the inexperienced coaches decision to start the 4231 and style of play that would take them all the way to the finals 2 years later.

  27. SamDC says:

    I agree, Van Basten with all his inexperience was more successful than Van Gaal with Oranje. If only Van Basten had played Van Nistelrooy against Portugal in WC2006, we probably would have moved on. Who knows where that team would have gone. Defensive failures between Mathijsen and Ooijer doomed our game against Russia in overtime.

    Van Gaal couldn’t even manage to get past Ireland with all that encyclopedia of football knowledge in his head.

    • Demi says:

      >Defensive failures between Mathijsen and Ooijer doomed our game against Russia in overtime.

      agree on both your points, especially not playing Van Gol against Portugal was a criminal act 🙂

      As per the Russian game, imagine what support Van Bommel could be offering. Would Kolodin behave like that if Mark was there to “break” him ?

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9M4NvvrzjM

      Marko failed both elimination game tests …

  28. SamDC says:

    What is done is done! I was infuriated with the appointment of Van Gaal. IMO, he’s just the wrong person for the job at the wrong moment. I have stated my reasoning in previous posts.

    At this point, we just have to see how he does in the first two games. A friendly against Belgium next month will give him an opportunity to make some changes and a big qualifying match against Turkey that would be the first major test.

    Hopefully, for the sake of the team, he drops his ego and tries to build the team back up again. Even though I don’t like the guy at all, I wish him the best for the sake of my love for Oranje!

    • Bret from SoCal says:

      @ SamDC;

      I am in complete agreement with you. Of all the candidates, van Gaal was the one I dreaded. And of course, he is the one selected. Of course I want nothing but success, but my reasoning is ready for a 2-year long cringe. I really think it is very possible that we do not qualify for WK 2014. Would it be a shock and way beneath our goals? Of course. But part of me is ready for it to happen already.
      Personally, why was it so paramount that we “had to” select a Dutchman as coach? Was not Ernst Happel the skipper during our 1978 run? I don’t know… I just don’t get it.
      Madness I tell you, madness!

    • Demi says:

      How about this? Let Gaal do some cleanup, hopefully with the easy group we have he will not f up too much. In a year or so if the team is on a better road we can swap him for someone better ? I can live with this thought 🙂

  29. Miguel Rosado says:

    Yes, I have to agree Van Basten did better than Louis’ 1st spell let’s hope his 2nd spell can lead the national team to great football.

  30. hurshi says:

    Holly fudge. Sneijder goes to Andgy, Russian billionaire club to join his buddy Eto’O.
    It’s that the beginning of the end?

  31. Gio says:

    Yes, Van Gaal failed but he has progressed as a manager. Barcelona, Az and Bayern is enough evidence that he is a modern manager with skills. With all due respect to Marco, but I can’t say the same about him.
    I admit though that Van Gaal needs to be more wiser in his approach and use the limited time he has to perfection, he needs to avoid crazy methods such as pulling down his pants in front of his own players or constantly shouting at them like they are terrorists at Guantanamo because it creates confusion. He will only meet these players once every two months, training will be limited for a week or two. But look at the bright side, he is a strong believer of teamwork, not afraid of red flag’ing any individualist including stars with egocentric attitudes and takes note of everything. Meaning that if Van Persie or even Huntelaar misses clear cut chances then they are definitely out or he will kung-fu kick any amateur mistakes by defenders. You guys wanted the red carpet treatment to be thrown out, well Van Gaal is your guy, he will voluntarily take out the garbage, don’t worry. My only concern about this guy is his attitude (full stop)

  32. Alex says:

    Odd thing is with van gaal, he might be a good tactician, you always have to think he just had too big of an ego or urge to control that he makes himself a problem. I just hope he’ll do what’s necessary and doesn’t fail.

  33. SamDC says:

    @Demi,
    I disagree with you about the easy group comment. I don’t think we are in an easy group.

    Netherlands
    Turkey
    Romania
    Hungary
    Estonia
    Andorra

    Turkey, Romania and Hungary are all capable of beating us if we slip especially on the away games.

    Turkey failed to qualify for the 2006 and 2010 WCs. They missed out on Euro 2012. They’ll be more hungry than ever to qualify.

    My point is that, only one team will qualify outright from the group. 2nd placed teams will have to play a playoff.

    I also don’t know if you can just dump van Gaal midway through qualification unless things get really bad. He’s not here as a caretaker manager.

    • Demi says:

      no doubt it is not a walk in the park. I am also concerned about qualification. But it is certainly not a death group either.

      you know, if Gaal makes some moves to clean house, we manage to get good enough points to qualify but the performance is not there… maybe they will decide to swap him with Rijkard or Hiddink when their contracts are over … I think Guus’ contract is over next summer. That might be a much better time to find a coach who actually has a real chance of delivering the Cup.

      I know.. I am hoping. What can I say? It is hard to stomach Gaal…

  34. goldstone says:

    Here’s a bright thought about Van Gaal, courtesy of David Winner and his “Brilliant Orange” (p264, lamenting the popularity of “results football,” “a harsher, less lovable new spirit”):

    “With the exception of Louis van Gaal at little AZ, no one seems much interested in playing with style and adventure any more.”

    Keep ‘hup’ alive, Oranje! 😉

  35. Hien says:

    If he still kung-fu kick then he is still crazy…after all these years. After the first 5 qualification games there is a break for 5 months from Oct 2012 to Mar 2013. If it does not go well then perhaps it is at this time to find a replacement. I still hope Oranje qualify for the WC 2014. At this point it is hard to predict. We can miss the WC or win WC and I hope for the latter, like always.

  36. eduardo says:

    Heereveen is asking 6 millions for Narsingh.

    that is insane if you compare with anothers players: hereenveen sold Assaidi for 3.5 to Galatasaray (who is better player than Narsingh, or at least at the same level) and Juve sold Eljero Elia for 6.5.

    So Heerenveen can’t ask that amount.

  37. Hien says:

    1 friendly game is not enough for a new coach. I think KNVB needs to organize another friendly game in addition to Belgium game before WC 2014 qualification game.

  38. Carlos says:

    Some BREAKING earth shattering News which will surprise and shock you
    Joao Havelange was accepting bribes when he was FIFA president. I was shocked to learn this and the follow up report that discovered that the Pope was Catholic !
    and Sepp – Blatters along still

  39. Miguel Rosado says:

    It really is amazing to read how low some people think of Van Gaal.

    He’s done more good than bad to Dutch football. I will never forget his Ajax, just imagine if those players had stayed together at Ajax for 5 or 6 years!!!.

    He has had success with every team he has coached (Ajax, Barca, AZ, Bayern) except one and he wants revenge so in my opinion he deserves the benefit of the doubt.

    I am not saying he is our savior but just that he is someone who deserves a 2nd chace. Why? because he is the only one with enough balls to coach this team full of egos.

    @Gio: Agree with you on this “You guys wanted the red carpet treatment to be thrown out, well Van Gaal is your guy, he will voluntarily take out the garbage, don’t worry”

    *Here some links of Louis:

    Great football from Ajax vs Real Madrid

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DpE7Ef5pwUs

    At Ajax 1995:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YHtl3rXWZu8

    At Barcelona:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eunrWXuPpN0

    At Bayern:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EhJr015Vsjs

    Az title celebrations:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8d4UDDXhZuY

    *Iniesta thanking Van Gaal:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYyNqiHy95g

    *But he’ll have to improve this lol 😛

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VhERJW3ftkw

  40. Eduardo says:

    Ajax instead of develop Dutch talents, want to sing a U21 Spanish full back to replace Vertonghen.

    http://www.goal.com/en/news/11/transfer-zone/2012/07/12/3236962/ajax-are-interested-in-barcelona-youngster-muniesa-confirms

    Spain won WC and EC copy Dutch football, and now Ajax want to work for them, develop Spanish players?

    Also this player has the same age, and play at the same position than Daley Blind.

    I´m not agree at all. Ajax should sing Nuytinck, Viergiver, Donk or Douglas.

  41. SamNY says:

    Afellay’s days with barca are numbered. Looks like he’s heading to EPL with Arsenal, Tottenham and Liverpool all interested. I dont mind him joining RvP in Arsenal as long as he stays.

    VdV is on the radar of clubs in……….UAE!!!!! I guess that is early retirement for him.

    Robben not going anywhere and neither is Sneijder… It really didn’t help them that Oranje did so poorly in EU2012…

  42. Bitterballen says:

    I think we took BVM for granted. True, he made big mistakes but when you look at his track record he deserved to stay on…. at least for the first few WC2014 qualifier games… It’s one thing to be unlucky and lose crucial tournament matches but it’s another thing to have 2 near-seamless qualifier campaigns with a WC finals appearance… and I disagree with a lot of you about our need to play offensive ‘fun’ football at the expense of positive results… for the first time (WC2010) we finally had some luck on our side and were a hair away from winning. I actually LIKED our strategy because it worked. Don’t forget, we were also denied a crucial corner in the final after Wes’ free kick which led up to Spain’s goal.

    I always said that unless we had a solid coach to replace BVM it made no sense to replace him and it pains me to repeat that statement… Hiddink was the only option…

    I miss BVM already.

    • JK says:

      but it wouldnt have worked with him on. he wasn’t fired, he resigned. The players just weren’t responding to his methods any longer. this is natural and it happens. You move on. Such is football, such is life;)

      Better days ahead for sure mate…

    • Richard says:

      I agree, to a point. Italy tried to play open, fun football against Spain–and we saw how that turned out!

      Holland has good talent but new coach will have to make some good personnel decisions as team was a mess all over the field in the Euro. What to do about Robben? Lots of decisions.

  43. Abhirup says:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EL4i443VhjM&feature=relate

    Can anybody translate what LVG is saying over here???

  44. OranjeBoom says:

    “I think we took BVM for granted” – Bitterballen

    Having regrets already? As Bob has said a few times (and I agree) that the 2010 WC was a one off… a surprise. We did play really well. But BvM didn’t look to improve what went wrong. He thought he could continue (while breaking some of his own rules) doing things the same way with the same squad. We saw the outcome.

    Yes we may have won a great percentage of matches but I have been complaining about our football since 2010. I bleed Oranje but the football after the WC has been unwatchable for me. I would get nailed on forums for my opinion but now much of the Oranje now in 2012 feel the same. There were so many matches that we won, but the play on the pitch was shit. 11 Strangers getting in each other’s way.

    I for one am looking forward to Dutch Football. I hope LvG can provide it.

  45. OranjeBoom says:

    Wow and if this story of VdV to the UAE has any truth he can say hello money & GOODBYE CAREER!

  46. Miguel Rosado says:

    @Eduardo: I totally agree with you!!!.

    Ajax, PSV, Feyenord, Twente, etc should focus on developing Dutch players not foreign players especially when Holland has the right players to fill those spots as you said we have Donk, Blind, Viergever, Anita!.

  47. Miguel Rosado says:

    Heres is a list of Dutch players who can be in Louis’ plans:

    1 Stekelenburg
    2 Krul
    3 Vorm
    4 Vermeer
    5 Velthuizen

    6 Bruma
    7 Maduro
    8 Douglas
    9 Pieters
    10 Mathijsen
    11 Heitinga
    12 Van Aanholt
    13 Willems
    14 Büttner
    15 Van Rhijn
    16 Viergever
    17 Vlaar
    18 Wiel
    19 Boulahrouz
    20 Donk

    21 Sneijder
    22 Vaart
    23 Strootman
    24 Nigel
    25 Afellay
    26 Schaars
    27 L.Fer
    28 Classie
    29 Anita
    30 Emanuelson
    31 Drenthe

    32 Robben
    33 Persie
    34 Huntelaar
    35 Kuyt
    36 Elia
    37 Babel
    38 O. John
    39 Lens
    40 Narsingh
    41 S. de Jong
    42 L. de Jong
    43 Maher
    44 Wolfswinkel
    45 Boerrighter
    46 Wijnaldum
    47 Bakkal

    Some of this list should leave like Boulah and Kuyt. Also of course I might be forgetting some names but we have a good mix of youth and experienced players.

    HUP HOLLAND! 🙂

  48. hurshi says:

    Looks like that new Barca away Orange-Yellow kit is an implied acceptance of Oranje school? 🙂

  49. overmars says:

    I don’t know about you guys, but I almost cried watching the highlights that Jan posted in the video above for the WC final against Spain. The music coupled with the missed chances brought tears to my eyes. Two years later, I still cannot get over that loss. I don’t know if I’ll ever see Oranje in a WC final again in my lifetime 🙁

    • Demi says:

      feels like a dagger in my heart

      🙁 🙁 🙁 🙁

    • Bitterballen says:

      don’t say that.. unless you are 85 years old… 🙂

    • OranjeFan says:

      Agree – the whole post was awesome – well worth a contribution the “Fill Jan’s Beer Fridge fund”

      🙂

      Thanks Jan

    • Balkan says:

      Overmars, I hear you brother. Believe or not i haven’t found the strength to watch wc2010 highlights and actually I haven’t even seen Iniesta’s goal. I can’t. I suffered too much during and especially after the game. For days I had no desire to do anything, I felt gutted and depressed.
      I too think that it was my best and only chance to see Holland win a WC.

      • overmars says:

        Wow Balkan! Besides the WC 2010 pain, the 2 most painful moments I’ve endured was WC 1998 semi-final and EC 2000 semi-final. In both instances I knew in my heart that Oranje won’t win the penalty shoot-out.

        I wonder what the future holds for us! Would we ever watch our beloved Oranje win the WC in our lifetime? We tried beautiful total football and it didn’t work. We tried pragmatic patience football and it didn’t work either 🙁

  50. Hien says:

    I am not questioning Van Gaal’s talents. I just have doubt on his crazinesss and ego which may affect his decisions/strategy.
    I have not gotten over the WC 2010 loss yet, but I really hope to see Oranje winning WC in my life time. I still blamed it on Robben, but I will not cut him. Like Van Gaal he may have to earn redemption somehow.

  51. Hien says:

    Yes, I expect Oranje to qualify and win WC 2014 somehow. Believe it or not many still think only a handful of teams can upset Spain (note that I use the word upset) and they are Germany, Portugal, Netherlands, Brazil, Argentine and Uruguay.

  52. Bitterballen says:

    uruguay too yes, good point

  53. Hien says:

    I may forget Italy as a contender if Pirlo still can play well in 2 years or they can find someone to replace Pirto. Having say that Oranje has enough talents to win.

  54. overmars says:

    I still cannot believe how unfair this has been. Every time I watch it, I feel utter pain. Watch the video posted by Jan above for WC 2010 final starting at minute 3:12. Heitinga laid his finger on Iniesta’s shoulder. Iniesta’s dive deserved an oscar for best acting. Heitinga got a red card. Then the same freaking cheater scored the game’s winning and only god. Unbelievable. Totally unbelievable 🙁 🙁 🙁

    • Demi says:

      Heitinga’s first yellow was made up too… ridiculous. Kind of like Spain had to win it no matter what….

      As per the BS that goes around that they somehow played “total football”, I just watched the final one more time in its entirety tonight. To make sure before I make the following comment.

      Spain played as many back passes as we did. No less for sure. Pique and Puyol kept in their confined squares as much as De Jong did. Some folks here need an optometrist 🙂

  55. Alex says:

    I still think people focus too much on refs, we could’ve played on for 50, 60 or 70 minutes more with 11 players we still would never have beaten Spain in that final, it just wasn’t meant to be, they were better and IT just wasn’t our lucky day. Regardless of poor or good refereeing.

  56. Hien says:

    I disagreed. If PK then it is hard to say who is going to win. It is 50-50.

  57. SamNY says:

    there is a series of events that happened that final that suggest that spain was setup to win the game, regardless of whether Robben had scored the chance or not…

    1. The Heitinga two cards… Iniesta should have been yellow carded for the dive – it didn’t help that Oranje was playing without their 1st choice CB
    2. The Foul on Robben by Puyol. ANY other game, that would have been an immediate red card.3
    3. The shot by Sniejder that was turned away to corner, but somehow Howard Webb gave a goal kick that started the attack that spain were able to score the goal.

    • Demi says:

      >>2. The Foul on Robben by Puyol. ANY other game, that would have been an immediate red card.3

      WTF was that!!!!!!! OMG, was so odious as Argentina 1978 !!!

      an out of this world decision.

      BTW, all of your points are valid 100%. Webb came in the second half with a mission.

  58. Hien says:

    Referee’s decision is something Oranje may not be able to control, but had we been more clinical in our finish (eg Robben’s 1st chance) the game may have been different. Same with 78. Argentine-Peru game was so obvious. Too many if in all 3 Finals loss. We needed to put the game out of reach like the 88 team did. Even the ref gave USSR the PK, Van Breukelen prevented any comeback.

    • SamNY says:

      there is a big difference between what i said and what the usual public says… i am 100% certain Webb assisted spain with the win, no doubts about it.

      Against Italy, they totally deserved the win – they won fair and square but webb came out on a mission. He yellow carded RvP (way too far from the goal and way too early), Robben (for complaining about webb’s not given foul), vBommel, DeJong (even when he did not see the foul – that is key), Heitinga twice. Pretty sure there was one or two more cards handed out as well.

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