Louis van Gaal doesn’t doubt stuff. He doesn’t doubt, full stop! And in particular not himself.
But… Lately, with Strootman taking a big injury hit and half of the Dutch internationals under performing at their clubs, he would be a fool not to doubt stuff. Like: “who will I take along”, “what kind of midfield will I use”, “will I go for 4-3-3 for real?”, “Can I find an honourable way to get out of this job NOW?”…. ( Btw: rumours go that Man United wants to talk to LVG for a role at Old Trafford…)
In a recent interview, Van Gaal – for the first time in a long while – said he was reconsidering the set up of his midfield. He decided earlier on, on using a three man midfield with “the point aiming back”. Or one central defensive mid and two offensive players. These two would have been Sneijder and Strootman. With the latter being able to support the former. With Stroot out of the picture, the make up of the midfield might need a change, is what Louis said.
The options he has are clear. Play with two holding mids and one central offensive midfielder. Playing De Guzman and De Jong or Blind and De Jong with a more agile and moving number 10. I don’t think Siem de Jong would be the man for that, but Wijnaldum or Klaassen could be that player. Even Robben and Van Persie have played there. As has Rafael van der Vaart but he will first get back to fitness before even thinking about Brazil.
Sneijder (and Van der Vaart) might be too static for the Van Gaal midfield Mark II, mind you…. Adam Maher in form would be the ideal player, by the way…
Or LVG resorts back to 4-1-4-1. Or 4-2-3-1. With RVP the lone striker. Or even a solution with Hunter as lone striker… but I doubt that Louis will venture there.
Anyway, big question marks. Van Gaal clearly says he doesn’t see a replacement for Strootman in the Strootman style. Van Ginkel, Afellay, Klaassen, Fer…all possibilities. But none of them has what Stroot has. Some have no rhythm, some lack the skills and qualities.
Wesley Sneijder doesn’t seem to have impressed Van Gaal. Not sure what this means though…. In personal meetings? In his role as playmaker in the games he played? At Galatasaray? And is a 100% fit Immers better than a 80% fit Sneijder? Does this comment mean that Wes is not yet on the list of 23?
Van Gaal voiced concerns over Sneijder’s level of performance in Turkey and declared that only in-form players will be on the plane to Brazil.
Van Gaal told Dutch media source NRC, “You should be able to deliver at club level every week. If you can’t deliver at your club, then you most definitely can’t deliver at the national team.
“He [Sneijder] will play in Turkey until the middle of May, so I will wait and see. There is no need to decide before then.”
Sneijder’s contribution to the Netherlands team over the years has been immense. His performances at Euro 2008 saw him named in the UEFATeam of the Tournament, and two years later he appeared in the All-Star World Cup Team—with his displays in South Africa being a major reason behind his nation’s route to the final, where they lost to Spain in extra time.
In addition to his impressive international achievements, Sneijder has enjoyed a trophy-laden club career. The Dutch No. 10’s CV boasts titles in Holland, Spain, Italy and Turkey, as well as five domestic cups.
However, his crowning achievement came in 2010, when he won the Champions League with Inter Milan. Sneijder, who has previously scored a crucial goal in the semi-final, provided the assist for Diego Milito’s opener in the 2-0 triumph over Bayern Munich.
Sneijder is widely regarded as one of the greatest attacking midfielders in Europe and has returned 12 goals in all competitions for Galatasaray this term, and his omission from the Netherlands setup would be a huge shock to all.
What does this all mean?
I know Frank de Boer knows what to do. “Sneijder? I would always take him along. I don’t want to sit on Louis’ chair but I think that whatever solution you pick for the midfield, three or four in diamond or 4-2-3-1….that is determined by the quality of the players I think, but whatever system you use, you need players with that extra creative spark. That uniqueness. Sneijder has the ability to win a game for you. The venom, the will to win, the class, the persistence. He can score from a dead ball or create a chance out of nothing or play the through ball no one saw…. I would take him always.”
This is where I think a coach has a big call to make: either the Team is the most important or you mould your team around a couple of aces. Van Gaal would normally go for the former. Make the team key. So rather three hardworking and dependable midfielders (like PSV changed its midfield and like De Boer still uses Poulsen) then one artist that doesn’t always perform and two players in his service. The teams that excel are the teams were everyone battles and fights and works their arse off. Liverpool, Bayern, Atletico Madrid, Everton…. This is where Spain will be vulnerable… Anyway, Sneijder….one needs to change the team around so Sneijder can deliver. I see him in the Cabaye/Pirlo role. Deeplying, next to Nigel de Jong. With Robben, Klaassen/Wijnaldum and Lens in front of them and RVP deep centrally.
Although I would love to use Robben as the number 10. Centrally. With Depay on the left and Lens on the right.
This does look like a very offensive line up but why not. If you go down, go in flames!!
It seems like Oranje is in a spot of bother.
Johan Cruyff spoke about Oranje recently. And was quite clear. “Listen, I don’t want to interfere with the work of Van Gaal and I don’t want to say things that people can then use to put pressure on him. But….fact of the matter: it will be very tough in Brazil. Surviving the group will be quite an achievement. Spain and Chile in the draw, aaargh…. Just two very good sides. And attacking sides too. Our problem is not that we lack quality. We have a lot of great talents. But this is the problem: most are just talents. They need a couple of seasons extra to be ready for the World Cup. In 1974, we had one talent in the team, in Rijsbergen. Our goalie was already experienced and so was the rest. Both Ajax and Feyenoord had just won the European Cup 4 times in a row, amongst them. De Kromme, Jansen, Nees, Rensenbrink, Krol, Rep…all experienced lads. World Class. Now it’s different. Our key players are the forwards. When midfield or defence can’t play themselves out of pressure, it will not help too much who we have upfront. We could have Messi and C Ronaldo as well, but if they don’t get the ball, we won’t score.”
When the interviewer suggested we need to play ultra defensive football, JC exploded. “No! Wrong! I hear people say this. It’s the dumbest thing you can do. If your defence is your weakest link, don’t play defence!! It’s simple. We want the ball to be with RVP and Robben and those lads. Also, play your strength. If our lads are young and quick, play unpredictable football. Put the pressure on them. Sure, we’ll concede, but we need to make sure we score more than they do and it’s all good.”
May 7 is the day LVG will start with his formal prep work. A big group of Eredivisie players will join in and he will most likely also invite players of Young Oranje, to keep the numbers interesting. Van Gaal has three periods of three days planned. He will announce his first squad list on May 2. Van Gaal will go for short but intensive sessions. After three days, the lads can go home for a bit. The second session will be with the players from the English and German competitions.
After returning from Portugal, Holland will prepare for a friendly against Ghana on May 31 in Rotterdam. Holland will play a last friendly in Holland in De Arena against Wales. On June 2, Van Gaal will announce the 23 players who’ll take the flight on June 5 to Rio.
In Brazil, Oranje will training on the Flamengo facility, on walking distance from the players hotel at Ipanema beach. The facilities are authentic. Maybe old fashioned. But the pitch got priority and is exactly the same in terms of blade length as the official venues: 1,8 to 2,0 mm.
” If your defence is your weakest link, don’t play defence!! It’s simple. We want the ball to be with RVP and Robben and those lads”
^ THIS is good. I very much enjoyed reading it. Thanks.
Sorry, i have posted the following at the end of the last page
I’ll leave it here instead.
And Thanks Jan.
I have an idea, and maybe it might be too big for this comments bit, and maybe it needs another page, i don’t know.
Everyone loves posting their lineups – sometimes several different ones in the same day (or hour, Tiju I am looking at you, buddy), and i was thinking…
All so different, but many with great theories woven into the fabric of the teams you guys create.
There is something called the ‘wisdom of crowds’ – which, to be short, states that whereas the chances of one person’s guess being correct are very small, the chances of the average of everyone’s guesses being correct are high, and get higher as more people are added.
So, then I was reading another site – and they had conducted some voting polls for who should play where, but never really full teams – and again, to be short, the average results for some positions started to become eye-opening.
Therefore, ALL it would take here is for everyone to post the following in the comments section:
a team of 11 players.
no substitutes, no alternatives (/), JUST 11 players.
11 PLAYERS ONLY!!!
If you post a slash(/) only your first player will be added to the average.
If you post a second team, only your first team will be added to the average.
SO THINK BEFORE YOU POST IT.
11 players only.
It is important for the mathematics.
Of course, there is a problem, the formation. We all agree to disagree on the formations all the time – haha!!
BUT LVG does not.
He will still probably play 433 – and it is the DUTCH way – and until we know differently (nearer the WC) this could serve as a test run.
So, there you have it.
We can all count, so there is no need for an arbiter or referee.
And we can work out averages as we go. The player with the most selections in a position becomes the current selection for our ‘wisdom of crowds’ team – which should, in theory, also be eye-opening. And hopefully fun.
We play the WORLD CHAMPIONS in our opening game.
Who are your 11 players?
I’m not posting mine right away because
a) i haven’t thought about it enough yet to be final
b) i don’t want to be the only one who posts, and look like a muppet (which i probably already do) when no one joins in
c) an experiment like this probably needs a new page itself! over to you, Jan! 😉
Now, this is a new page!!
So EVERYONE post (in your own time) and we can count them up at the end!
only starting line-up vs Spain,as asked:
Now you can swap the front 6 names around in all kinds of formations to make it fit wherever others have fit the same names or will do so if they like your idea. I will do one option now and sort of expect this one to count towards your exercise cause I think I prefer it, they are not subs or secondary choices, still the same 11:
vPersie and Sneijder can swap there, vPersie and de Jong can swap (you go point forward in formation, and if you do that anyway you can also use Klaassen in the middle instead and de Jong on the right, and of course Sneijder middle, but that would put either de Jong or Klaassen left and vPersie further forward). I find a limitation to one particular formation too easy to predict and defend against by the experienced players of Spain, so I would like them to mix it up like that, so how would you count that in your exercise?
very close to the above idea I had VDV in all the positions I have in mind for Sneijder except LW.
But I guess that wasn’t asked, but I kinda broke the rules already anyway. I just don’t want them to feal limited to one position, they all know all the positions and they should go with the flow, move where the space is on offence and close the gaps when defending. Don’t care about formation other than in a general sense, these guys are all experienced enough to think up their own tactics and formations during the game, they don’t need vGaal or anyone else for that.
N. de Jong is the anchor. His help on defence will not come from Strootman this time, but from Klaassen. The rest will have to work out how to score as they go, they should know by now.
edit: I just found out that “anchor” is not the correct english expression of the Dutch expression I had in mind which is “rots in de branding”, which google leads me to “true blue” in english but I don’t like that expression as much as the Dutch one, literally in english that would be that de Jong is our ‘rock in the breaking waves of the sea’ (dunno if the “of the sea” part is necessary).
———Nigel De Jong———-Van Ginkel———-
——————-Van der Vaart———————
Not really the 11 I prefer, but a balanced team for me. I would love Afellay but his crosses and unability to raise his head when playing on the left make me nervous. And as CM, I think he is not good for the balance of the team cause his defending is quite poor, Van Ginkel is less good going forward but can help Nigel defensivly. Afellay can come for 30 last minutes replacing a tired VDV.
Laurent your line up is so excellent,has 4 torpidos-i mean speedy boys–Willems-Jnamat-Roben lenz with scintilalting skills…Vlaar the leader in back with reikik with younger legs…Van ginkel the runner.only issue we have is vaart stamina,i am sure vaart can retain it.like wilson said it wouldnt be bad calsie as playmaker
here goes mine
for me as first team 11.
Second team not for hooli(US)but for my satisfaction as arm chair coach.
For me Clasie is no option anymore, even if I like him, he said himself after the game against France that he was not in that level yet. Let him to go to Italy or England, take few kilos of muscle, and after we will consider him again.
VDV stamina problems are noticable on a whole club season, but it’s different on a short period like it will be in WC. Especially as I don’t expect us to play more than 4 games.
Remember how bad was Van Bronchkorst’s stamina with Feyenoord and NT 2007-2010, always suffering. I really didn’t want him to be a starter during WC 2010. But he did good, he gave everything.
We need VDV for his corner kicks, free kicks, long shots, assists, combinations with VP…
Exactly what i think about Clasie: he needs to improve physically. He needs to work hard and become stronger, it happened to Verratti in his last 2 years and may happen to Clasie if he went to a more physical league.
with typical Van Gaal he will take both sneijder and Vaart given that the midfield after strootman injury looks pretty much inexperienced with the eredivise players but then again looing at their form the same can be said for two general. maybe we should play clasie in that role given his precision passing and pace. his defense is definitely a problem given his light weight. could be an alternative.
Sterling having a cracker of game for Liverpool. 2-0 HT vs Man city.another man to watch at WC.
next robben in making or may go one better.
laurent……Lens on the left……he seems to be rusty in that position.
I agree and I’m not really sure about him. But I put him cause he helped us a lot during qualifying.
Who else can take the spot ? Depay ? I’m not sure neither.
Wijnaldum can be lethal on the left wing coming on his right foot with speed,he scored many goals from that side with PSV, but it has never been tested with NT.
Also Elia, Babel, John are no bad wingers for me.
So I don’t worry much for the LW spot, as long as Kuyt doesn’t take it.
I would go for 3-5-2 or 5-3-2 , like Juventus :
________ Krul/Cillessen _______________
___________n. De jong/ Vlaar __________
__ Veltman/van Dijk ___ Rekik/Kongolo__
___________ Sneijder/ Clasie __________
______ Robben/Depay ______ Persie/Huntelaar ___
looks really good. Kuyt will add a lot of experience and Dynamics to the midfeild.
Srinjoy punished him for poor dribbling skills.
the form of wijnaldum , van ginkle will be key for both sendjer and vaart.
Strootman and RVP both sitting with LVG at PSV/Fey.
Van Der Wiel Vlaar rekik willems
van ginkel and fer
robben sneijder depay
I think this squad compensates for deficiencies in the team – athleticism and work rate in fer and ginkel
chemistry with williems and depay( unknown quantity to opposition)
robben and wiel can feed huntelaar when sneijder is being heavily marked.
Vlaar has leadership and experience in leading a defence at villa.
I couldn’t really choose between rekik and veltman but get the benefit to rekik because veltmans errors could haunt us.
I also think KJH needs a crack of the whip, especially if we focus on him scoring then as a plan b we have loads of options for goals in sneijder, depay, robben and in the air from fer. There is a lot of dynamism in this team
haha whats going on ..poulsen and mathijsen scoring..haha
Oh what a goal from Janmaat!!!
A mighty strike!
LvG and Strootman not amused with that. LOL
Klaassens goal was a sweet one, too, at 1:10:
Hmm no that’s a banal one. Banal goal for a banal player.
That’s a lot of repetition for a one line post. Congrats! 😉
I don’t know why you guys despise Klaassen that much. I mean the guy is down to earth , has a very good attitude and a very good work rate on the pitch.
He is not Bergkamp of course and he is not a technical magician , but still he is a very good player imo and I think he will improve even more.
I posted his statistics last week, poor assists and opportunities created rate. That’s what he is expected to do for an AM no ?
He just score Immers goals against ADO, RKC, Cambuur etc. he is really nothing special, it’s normal he is down to earth with such a little talent.
We don’t need nice and humble guys, we need good footballers. I prefer to have one Balotelli than 100 Klaassen.
Really Laurent? Don’t you have a job? I know France is in a recession, but maybe you could try to find something to do. You have way too much time on your hands.
And please try not to be so POSITIVE about the eredivisie, Dutch football, Oranje and Ajax. I really wished you were a little bit less partial!
For the moment no job indeed, I just bet on football games, what about you ? Seems like you were busy since that Salzburg victory…
Janmaat Indi Veltman Pieters
Nigel De Jong
De Guzman VDV
Lens RVP Robben
I want to put Robben at left, Netherland play better when Robben is at left instead of right.
As for subs:
VDW Vlaar Heitinga
Blind(for LB and DM)
Sneijder Klaassen Leroy Fer
Kuyt(for lockeroom, plus I can not find any in form wingers that is ready for world cup, Promes, Boetius are not there yet, Ola John and Elia does not have enough playing time)
That finish my 23.
I mean KJH not KDJ
Other player that may get a chance: (some of them are not in form after injury)
Hakim Ziyech: recently get tired, light weight, has stamina problem, but he get the creativity. Currently, Maher is still away from his No.10 position, there are only two games left so Maher is out for me.
Marco Van Ginkel: He can be potentially better than Strootman, but he need to play!The chance is very slim though.
Ola John: Needs playing time, after several games Hamburger is back to its terrible form. He was doing great last year with Benfica but this season is a drawback.
Davy Propper： He was complimented by multiple commentators after the Ajax game. Provided two assists last game. He is definitely in form now and has the creativity and work rate. He is an in form but less quality Van Ginkel.
Virgil Van Dijk: If Van Gaal is open to take risk, then Virgil Van Dijk can take Heitinga’s place.
Wijnaldum: Slowly trying to gain back his form. If in form he can start at the place of De Guzman.
Narsingh: Poor Narsingh, after the recovery he is still trying to find his feet. His first several games for NT was brilliant but sadly the injury brought him down. Very sad, if he did not get injured he might start instead of Lens. Currently, he is still not in form.
Viergever: more balanced player than Pieters, consistent but inexperienced in national team. I think Van Gaal should give him a try.
Elia: needs to be more consistent.
I would be surprised if somebody I did not mention go to Brazil.
kishna and Zivkovic and Depay can do better job than kuyt..its the high time to forget kuyt.if Davids can be dropped for 2006Wc,then KUYT IS A MUST DROP.
In the first game vs Spain, we can play either 4-2-3-1 (like Brazil at Confederation) focusing on strong defence with quick counter attack or 4-3-3 (pressing style like Ajax vs Barca, disrupt Xavi-Iniesta-Busquet triangle). If 4-3-3 then my starting is 11 is similar to Laurent with a few changes.
———Nigel De Jong———-De Guzman———-
——————-Van der Vaart———————
If we play 4-2-3-1 then I sub De Guzman with Fer, VDV with Sneijder and Lens with Depay.
I’ll offer two lineups as LVG could still change his formation now that Strootman’s injured.
———de Jong———-van Ginkel———-
——————-van der Vaart———————
Robben———Nigel De Jong———-Van Ginkel———-van der Vaart
wow! this is interesting already!!!!
looks like we have a goalie coming to the front straight away.
yes, i think when we are closer to the first match we will know LVG’s tactics a little better maybe, and then we can do a proper one of these in the real formation with the real players…
i guess i can post the results at the end of the thread, when we have maximumized our wisdoms
and i knew most of you would break the rules already!! haha. fortunately i account for that!
Well done, to the front, straight away… a proper one indeed!
You’re my kind of Yank, Hoolie. You speak proper English!
Here are some more tips:
Gor blimey guv, i’m no septic.
But my ‘mom’ is.
Thanks for the tips.
It seems Willems has had a severe injury vs Feyenoord. He may miss thr WC. 😕
thats really sad for him but is it time for buttner?
Ehhh, not a big loss as we have other options. Truthfully I’ll never feel completely safe with Willems at LB.
We have Pieters, Kongolo, Buttner, and Emanuelson to choose from.
Nigel De Jong
Solid and stubborn in the midfield. Although Catania were looking to mix it in the middle, none of their players dared take on the Dutch giant.
Came on in the final moments to replace Constant.
Gregory van der Wiel
Van der Wiel started the match brilliantly with a fine delivery for Cavani, but that remained his only highlight. Got forward on occasions, but defensively suspect.
Rarely called into action, partly due to Swansea’s solid defending and Salah’s wayward shooting, and was only beaten by an awkward deflection. Lost some of his composure towards the end of the game.
Jonathan De Guzmán
With Swansea a goal down, the Dutchman, in good scoring form, was thrown on late into the match, though made no impact.
@srinjoy this is why i called him shemale,not brave and defensivly equally shaky ,may be worse than van rhijn..i pick rhij over him.rhijn is too much good in attack..exceptional
Steen you are correct about hunter needing a crack of whip. At Schalke he is the main focal point and thats why he has been such a sensational form for them. When Hunter was injured coming into the new year Schalke were on aback flip 8th in Bundesliga and as soon as he arrived they are now in a command position for that CL spot. If you shift that focus off Hunter that where he becomes static and that what happened to him at Real Madrid and AC Milan. He is the kind of striker who shouldn’t be sitting on the bench but unfortunately for him the tide is always in the favor of RVP. BVM had the situations in hands in Euro 2012 after both Hunter and RVP were top scorers in Bundesliga and EPL respectively but again he went for RVP thinking that jus like in WC 2010 Sneijder will be the focal point with Robben which off course back fired and that is where he lost the plot and let loose everyone vs Portugal.
In Brazil I think it will be again RVP over Hunter even though RVP will be back fresh from his groin injury vs Hunter current form at Schalke. Also given the bonding between RVP and LVG that has been going on over the weeks in Holland and with rumors that Van Gaal might be on his way to Man United speaks the volume for itself.
I have always rated Hunter more than RVP simply because he possesses that sharpness that RVP doesnt have even though he may not be all rounder kind of a striker. I always wanted to see a confrontation duel between both to fulfill my lust as to who will win. when Schalke came to Arsenal in the CL RVP had already gone but again hunter made his statement that day and guess who was with him on his side that that day …..Afellay quite a Combo…. I wonder what would have happened if both of them would played that game.
I always find it absurd when I hear negative comments about him being static and etc coz if you know how to use him efficiently he can be the devils own.
Yeah I think it will be sad for him to never have a real chance, from what I hear he is one of the most feared players in the bundesliga
Interesting Feyenoord played 5-3-2. 5 at the back Janmaat,De Vrij,Mathisjen, BMI,Kongolo. Any Analysis on the Five.
It’s 3-5-2 in possession, or even 3-1-3-3
I like it. Holland can play like this. Most opponents at the WC will play with 2 forwards.
BMI on the left, Mathijsen central, De Vrij on the right
Kongolo and Janmaat playing as wingers. Both players have the legs and stamina to do this. Obviously, Koeman made space for them upfront by letting his forwards play more centrally.
LVG could do this too, using Robben and Robin as the two forwards.
Veltman Vlaar BMI
Janmaat Blind N de Jong Sneijder Kongolo
Robben Van Persie
Laurent, yes quite busy in fact. But I still watch the eredivisie and will celebrate Ajax’s 4th win in a row while you still look for a job! Don’t ask me to help you.
I will go to holidays next summer though, having bet 500e about Holland not doing more than 1/8 in WC. It was 1,9 when I put in january, now it’s less since that loss against France.
450e benefits, enough for spending a week in A’dam, will we finally meet ?
I would welcome that opportunity tremendously. I can invite you to join me in the Philips lounge for an Ajax game. All we have to do is agree on a specific match next season. Deal?
God bless you, Laurent. I didn’t realize you were struggling so.
May you find help and healing for yourself and your family:
Correction, please. Copied the wrong link, I think:
All the best to you, Laurent. It’s not easy to beat a gambling addiction, but now that you’ve owned up to the problem, you can start taking steps.
Thank you guys
quoting Cruijff from the article: “We want the ball to be with RVP and Robben and those lads.”
Then put RVP in midfield, he’ll see more of the ball and can help with the build-up towards Robben (and Hunter). He’ll be more a part of the game.
Either as the point forward in midfield (nr.10), or on either side, left is probably best if de Jong has the nr.6 point backward middle position.
More Cruijff: “When midfield or defence can’t play themselves out of pressure, it will not help too much who we have upfront.”
Klaassen handles himself well under Spanish pressure which Cruijff sort of already mentioned in other interviews and which we could have seen against Barcelona, and he would complete my 3-man midfield on the position he’s most used to at Ajax, on the right.
Sneijder is interchangeable with both vPersie and Klaassen in those line-ups (especially if you’re going to play point forward with a nr.10), would also depend on who is fit (Hunter for example) and the opponent. I would also consider him as an option for the LW.
If you play Robben left (for depth on the outside), I also like the idea of having Sneijder behind him on LM, de Jong CM, vPersie or Klaassen RM (depending on whether you’re going with vPersie as CF or Hunter). But I would want BMI or Pieters as LB then, not Blind, way too risky (I trust Robben to help out and overlap Sneijder defensively on the left). That would be the Pirlo role for Sneijder that the article spoke about, next to de Jong. Didn’t Strootman play on the right side of midfield for us once or twice? Then Klaassen would be a straight swap (and that would probably mean you would use vPersie as CF, you might still be able to use Hunter on the RW if you’re using Robben left).
Does that about cover all the options? Doubt it, but we’re not so out of options as some may think. Whether it’ll be enough? Who knows, I’m still waiting to see who will be in goal, then I know enough.
Even though I have posted my team it could legitimately be more preferable to play without Sneijder or van Der vaart . It hurts me to say this but for years Sneijder has been my favorite player. We could play rvp in Sneijders position behind Kjh in that way we have two intelligent strikers plus robben which could seriously devastate some teams . I rate Kjh above Diego Costa because he is experienced in just scoring goals , his positioning is second to none.
Costa scares the shit outta me, it gets worse every time he scores.
I was pretty pissed off when he chose to play for Spain instead of Brazil, then drawing Spain on top of that. Villa getting worse, Torres not getting playing time and Negredo not being quite as dangerous was good news for us (especially now that we’re in the same group). But ‘buying’ Costa fixed all that for Spain.
well we have to face brazil anyway, so on the face of it, not a biggie
In other news, its really worrying to see Stekelenburg wont get another game this season, and Krul and particularly Vorm in horrible form? Cillesen seemingly will be 1st choice but he doesn’t fill me with confidence! How did we dig ourselves into this hole?
I will try this out in coming friendly games and let’s see how is the performances and results.
Though it might be a bit weird but no harm for a try out.Yeah 🙂
——————-van der Vaart———————
best eleven 4-3-3
reason why is that lens provides perfect cover defensively for blind, and he and robben can switch, verheagh can defend and go forward good, whereas robben tends not to track back, de vrij and veltman are the best dribbling and passing defensive backs that help us keep possesion. van der vaart teams well with rvp.
watch that video and watch how de vrij just handles pressure easily, he would be a wonderful player when used against spain and chile, only issue is these mental lapses which is why i feel we should play with an old school sweeper like nigel de jong, and play like ajax did, veltman can push forward with great dribbles, de vrij passing is great.
the problem with drij is he is snail….thats it .aprat from that he is a deal in everyaspect,speedsters will TEAR HIM apart.i dont want to blame him for it.
Did u see Devrij vs Dries martins and co????Watch belgium vs Holland.?it would more worse when he face Silva,Navas,Costa, and Alexis,Vidal etc.Disaster in waiting.
Dunno where this sudden appreciation from de Vrij is coming, actually I hope its not because Feyenoord beat PSV with a 5 man defense.lol.
de Vrij is a liability, even Heitinga is more secure. de Vrij has as much of a chance to go to Brazil as van der Hoorn!
@srinjoy..Van der hoorn is Joke..no one talks about him,Devrij is 1000 times better than him,But Devrij is a snail.
no i’ve always been a big admirer of de vrij, he just makes mistakes from time to time, a lot of time rumours are just made up, but for certain liverpool are legitimately looking to add de vrij to their team. ALthough sakho and skrtel will probably get priority. it shows the talent and value. the same way fer almost signed with everton had it not been for knee problem.
de vrij has underwhelmed in games for oranje but there is a reason coaches and the like want him. and its because on the ball he is comfortable and at ease and he brings the luxury that he can pass an attacker and lay down a good pass. he’s kind of like a dutch martin demecellis if that makes sense. and if we need to, we could be like malaga and put him in defensive midfield
@This is for LVG
For a long time we are using Persie as striker and he has not scored much under BVM,but has scored under you with Vaart on pitch.its a fact..So lets play a gamble that since Vaart ,WEs are physically completely physically unfit; please go for the following line up vs Spain 90 minutes
if Hunter shits in this game with such high level players are team mates..let him go back to bench or should be dropped permanantly…
lets have a gamble..
I’m 100% with u.
Tiju we said the same after Huntelaar vs Portugal EC 2012 : If he shits in that game, no call anymore. That’s actually what Van Marwijk was planning to do.
Unfortunetaly he is still mentionned here, as long as he will score with Schalke people will mention him.
lets giv him one more chance for the sake of his fans..
I’m with Tiju…
—————– Krul —————–
Verhaegh —— Vlaar — Veltman —— Buttner
————— de Jong — v.Ginkel ——————
————————- v.Persie ———————–
Robben ————- Huntelaar ————— Lens
Williams seems out of WC,we have one lesser speedy back.BMI,or Blind will have torrid time vs speedsters.it really worries me th speed of our back line.
Neither vlaar,joris,heitinga,devrij are fast.seems BMI,bruma has some kind of pace still they make their own mistakes..
may be its the time to Buttner for williams and Kongolo for CB???
In my opinion Emanuelson or Anita can be a better and reliable option than Buttner or Willems in the left back spot.
And, of course, Pieters is very solid defensively.
EMMANULSON is interesting option we ha with pace/skill and stamina.Anita is not bad either.
I don’t think buttner is an option, simply because bench players like steks etc. Are not favored.
Eredivisie: The steady decline of Dutch football
Sad Stroy but it would be true, if ajax and psv and feyenoord cannot keep their players this year.
i hope something happened in netherland, like which happened for PSG last 2 year, someone come and buy a club like Twente or Feyenoord and then buy players like Ibrahimovic,
can it happened never???
wat is the deadline for coaches to select final 23 for wc???any one knows???
Each country must submit a 30-man provisional roster to FIFA by May 13. The deadline for the 23-man list is not until June 2. I think we can start guessing with 30 man squad instead of 23 for now.
It’s funny how everyone thinks Krul should start in goal, but he doesn’t really rank highly with LvG. I would also pick Krul, btw.
Willems confirmed he will miss WC.
Sneijder will definitely go to the WC.. I’m not sure he will be a starter, but he will definitely go.
hope I didn’t hype Krul too much on this blog, no one is perfect of course, but he is better than Cillessen and Vorm at the moment. Probably Stekelenburg as well, but Fullham’s keeper does usually have quite a bombardment to endure, which could happen to Krul in Oranje as well. But I’ve at least seen 1 game this season where Krul endured a massive bombardment by Tottenham (14 saves I think, cleansheet) and I’ve seen it before from him once he starts making save after save.
This guy would be my first choice LB:
—————– Krul —————–
Wiel ———Vlaar ——-Bruno ———–Pieters—-
————— de Jong ———-Fer ——————
————————- Sneijder ———————–
Robben ————-—————— ——Lens
Back to 4231 because we need to win, not play beautiful. Also, our back line will need a LOT of protection.
We need to employ the style of Atletico Madrid, they seem to tick against all big teams… we should too!
Stek (for experience)
For the Yank collecting 11’s
Janmaat De Jong Blind
a la Feijnoord
Here’s my team:
and because I can’t resist here’s my second team:
On standby: De Vrij, Klaassen, Boetius
does van Dijk play LCB at Celtic? He is rightfooted, right?
Since we’re all talking about it, we need the fastest 11 to be on the field. That means no Nigel De Jong.
No Sneijder… No VDV… No Vlaar…
This team would be the closest to Dortmund
On Defence…. this could easily turn into 4-4-2
Robben would be able to interchange with the wingers so he would play some middle, some left and some right. You would have 3 blazing fast players in Robben, Lenz and Depay… and a great link up player in RvP. Robben’s game would be less predictable and he’s already playing closer to the middle with Bayern.
Blind and Fer offer the lungs the defence needs… The only suspect position would be Veltman.
Ould-Chikh is definitely a player to watch in the future. He took the starting winger position at Twente Youth at age of 16 and has been really impressive recently. Scored 2 goals provide 1 assists in recent two games. He is kind of like a winger version of Maher.
Tiju……If you want to use Hunter you have to make him the focal point and in this case Robben to start on the left other wise its will be the same old story with sneijder no more the focal point will shift to Robben and the midfield will starting getting crowed with inverted wing system and this is where hunter will not be serviced efficiently and hence become static. Bayern has the luxury of Ribery and for that reason Robben starts on the left but if you like at most of the big Friendly games Robben has always found it hard on the right compared to the weaker teams. We have two natural right wingers Lens and Wijnaldum and it would be better we press deeper making space for hunter and RVP in the middle as you mentioned in your team. Dzeko is also in the same boat as Hunter at Man City and yet he has proven decisive for them on many occasion.
* Robben starts on right
I simply think that as long as you have a problem in the back line , you need to play with three Central defenders in the back-line , using one of the as a libero. This WC is the first international competition to all of our defenders except Vlaar who also never played in a WC before , only in the EC .
it can be 3-4-3 , 3-5-2 :
___ Cillessen ____
Veltman Vlaar Indi
____ N. de jong ____
Wijnaldum ___ Duarte
____ Sneijder ______
Robben Persie Depay
I used Duarte , even though he is not a regular starter with Ajax , cause he can fill the role on the left side both defensivly and offensively very good.
____ Cillessen __
Veltman Vlaar Indi
__ De jong __ Blind _
Lens___ Wes ____ Duarte
_____ Robben Persie ____
I also think Kuyt can be very good in this formation as a midfeilder. Clasie can also be very good with vaart and Blind in the midfeild against teams that may park the bus like Australia. Fer and Wijnaldum Can add a lot of dynamics in the line-up . It can work great for the this team.
We can also use Janmaat and Kongolo on the right and left in case we need more defensive solidity .
i liked ur selection of players based on combativeness,i mean Depay,wijnaldum and Duarte.
just trying something here:
secretly, it’s a 5-3-2, but shhh, we won’t tell anyone, certainly not vGaal.
Robben will have more midfield duties on the right, both de Jong and Veltman will be busy in the centre as well as helping out the defence, Janmaat and Kongolo can do what they did vs PSV when Koeman also used the 5-3-2. Janmaat, BMI and Kongolo have playing experience together at their club which helps with undertanding (positioning and who does what). Veltman’s position can also be played by Bruma or Douglas, but Veltman is possibly better in the build-up, dunno. VDV you can swap for Sneijder, Fer or vGinkel, depending on the scoreline and who will be part of the 23.
Now that I take a closer look at it, that’s sort of a Feyenoord defence, Ajax midfield and PSV, Ajax, Feyenoord attacking line (of course not talking about the clubs they’re playing at now).
Fifa 14 world cup video game dutch players stats :
Van Persie 90
Van der Vaart 83
Nigel De Jong 80
S. De Jong 78
L.De Jong 77
Ola John 77
De Guzman 77
Martins Indi 76
Van Ginkel 76
De Vrij 75
Van Wolfswinkel 75
Van Rhijn 72
It’s nice to know S. de jong is as good as Afellay. 🙂 .
It’s nice to know that there is no Klaassen 😀
Will buy this game with pleasure
Well they’ll update after the final 23 list of every country so he may be there after
I think the overall evaluation of the players is fairly reasonable. Good job by EA Sports.
Overall it’s ok, but I don’t understand why they always rate Nigel that low, was starter with City and now with Milan, key piece, deserves easily 83-84 for me.
Van Persie is overrated, doesn’t deserve more than 86-87 in my opinion.
Emanuelson underrated, not a fan of him but he deserves easily 77/78 for playing regularly with Milan. Same for Kuyt. If you give 84 to Huntelaar because he scores goals with Schalke, you should give at least 78/79 to Kuyt for scoring and being so important with Fenerbahce.
Cillessen, Vermeer, Siem, Maher, Narsingh and Luuk should all have beetween 73/75, not more. Would give 77 to Van Ginkel instead.
I’m bored, gonna make my own list, using some of your advice/opinions and including Klaassen 😛
Van Persie 87
Van der Vaart 82
Nigel De Jong 82
Van Ginkel 77
De Guzman 77
Martins Indi 76
Ola John 75
S. De Jong 75
L. De Jong 75
De Vrij 75
Van Wolfswinkel 75
Van Rhijn 72
Vilhena 72 (surely Vilhena is better than this? I’ve heard so much good about him, never really watched him though)
Mine would be :
Van Persie 86
Nigel De Jong 84
Van der Vaart 82
De Guzman 78
Van Ginkel 77
Ola John 77
Martins Indi 75
S.De Jong 74
Luuk De Jong 74
De Vrij 74
Van Wolfswinkel 73
Van Rhijn 73
notice there’s also no vdWiel (an I had to add Pieters as well), not to mention Anita, Büttner. Ok let’s finish up now…
vdWiel 75 or 76, can’t decide
Kongolo ? no idea
probably still missing some potential WC-participants.
v.Aanholt 75, maybe 76
edit: Depay to 77 to put him on par with Emanuelson and van Ginkel and a bit ahead of the other 76’s.
btw, Anita is 75-76 as midfielder (but 74 as LB)
Emanuelson and Anita are valuable and versatile players that are better than some guys Van Gaal uses to call.
Emanuelson can be an option in the bench for left back and left wing. Anita can be an option to right back, left back and defensive midfielder, he has fitness enough to play fine in all these positions.
Pieters is another good player, very solid defensively, that would be Oranje first choice for left back. Hes not slow and fragile as Blind and is a key player for his club.
Fer is another good player that is having a nice season. Im sure hes playing better than Guzman and Clasie, and could be a better substitute for Strootman than an out of form Van Ginkel.
agree they are versatile….but they are really average at their respective club.
Janmaat – Veltman – Vlaar – Buttner
Robben – RVP – Clasie – Wijnaldum
Pieters is very reckless with tackling.he nearly receives yellow card per every game.He is too risky given the likes of Navas/ Silva who will be leading the attack for spain. I havent seen much of Kongolo….BMI Defensively ok but offensively nothing spectacular. That leaves as with Buttner and he can constantly overlap and help Wijnaldum in attack.
De Jong will be stationery stationed at the heart only concentating on defence laterally.
The problem is Büttner is already back to the bench (and Evra scored a great goal so he’ll probably continue to play for the next few games up to our first friendly).
And Emanuelsson is also benched (but at least played a bit more this season and I feel he has more chance of playing time before our first friendly).
At least Pieters is playing every week and Stoke isn’t doing too badly in the Premier League (a bit the same as previous years, they’re doing better than Vlaar’s Aston Villa).
If fitness and playing time is so important to vGaal (and he probably has a point), our choices for LB probably should look like this (I know vGaal has a special place for Blind cause we haven’t seen anyone else for more than a few minutes except for Willems who is at the same quality level as Blind, eredivisie level):
5. Büttner (if he only had a bit more playing time, I’d easily move him up in this list, I expect him to be better than Pieters lately, not counting Pieters’ last game where he scored and won 1-0)
7. Willems (but I guess he’s out of the race now)
8. Schaars (just so I don’t leave out any options, did I miss anyone? Oh yeah…the one that is just too easy to overlook and would probably get stepped on if we have to face Brazil)
oh yeah, the new kid Kongolo. Well, he can’t be worse than Blind. So I’ll put him on 6 even though I’ve seen only a few highlights of him.
JEtro Willems is out.
In the Dutch Players Ranking Jeroen Zoet lost the first spot to Jordie Clasie, who had a cracker against PSV. Stefan de Vrij is also in great form and is in the top 3 of the list. A lot of people keep on talking about his mistakes earlier in the season but he clearly rose above that.
As we all know now, Bruma, Rekik and Veltman had their fair share of blunders this season so it’s fair to say that we have very talented but somewhat inexperienced lads at the back. We’ll need to make do with it.
I personally feel Van Dijk and Douglas should have been tested as well, but Van Gaal has analysed and scouted these two ad nauseam is what the feedback from the KNVB is, so he’ll know what goes on one has to accept….
Jan its very hard to judge De Vrij at eredivise level especially given what happened to him vs japan. the same as what happened to Blind vs France
Jan, is Willems out for the WC?
Is any chance he can go? A miracle like Robben recovery before the last WC?
as someone who’s given de Vrij a fair bit of criticism on this blog I have to agree with Jan that he’s shown quite a bit of improvement (and determination to make it to the WC), but I also have to agree with Wilson about the eredivisie. Difficult call, hence my choice for Douglas in my 23 (and the Brazilian connection).
What was that movie or tv-show again where someone said ‘anything that comes before the word “but” doesn’t count’? Oh yeah, game of thrones, a conversation with Tyrion.
I think vGaal has somewhat the same problem with vDijk and the Scottish league, but good scouts should be able to tell how good he is (I haven’t watched vDijk in the Scottish league, stopped watching Celtic-Ajax halfway through, don’t remember too much from Ajax-Celtic other than that Schöne scored and kept Ajax barely alive in the Champions League).
If vDijk isn’t selected as part of the squad (in my 23 that would probably mean he ends up taking over the spot from Douglas, which is also a gamble for me cause I haven’t watched Douglas either) and he turns out to be top premier league material after the WC(there are rumors of a big club transfer), you can blame the oranje scouts (or vGaal if he’s personally watched him, I dunno if he did). Who does that actually for vGaal? Scout out the players with potential for Oranje? Do we have like a big scouting team or do vGaal and his assistants Kluivert and Blind do everything themselves?
I guess they can do it between the 3 of them since all you need is decent videotapes. You don’t really need to be at the matches. But still wondering if they have scouts going around like the clubs have.
I like SamNY team above for Spain game. It is a fast team.
Blind and Fer Fast??????????????midfield will be blown away. Too slow IMO. The engine room has to be versatile
Fer is faster than blind.but Fer takes huge amount of time to pass th ball,the game flow killer.But he si so effective i retaining ball,and master of hard tackle ,which we saw after he replaced clasie Vs turket 1st WCQ2014 match.Leoroy fer is extreamly good at defending and in headers.Extreamly courageous to and warrior too,this we have seen vs Columbia when 2 warriors on feild i mean Stroot +fer.We got escaped by the presence of these players.but Fer also lacks the class and intelligence like Afellay,but when comes to menatlity Afeally is a girl and Fer is a man.
I agreed with Tiju on Fer ability to tackle, defensive. He can also score surprisingly goals. Perhaps I will replace Blind with De Guzman as De Guzman has good passing skill. Somehow I feel Blind will be a starter regardless if he will play LB or defensive mid.
They are definitely faster than Nigel De Jong. Anyone is faster than Nigel. You need big fast bodies to force the spanish into mistakes by being physical (I don’t mean brutal).
Qualifying out of the group requires we win against Spain. We won’t beat Chile. Barcelona is the heart and soul of Spain… and Spain are a bit more beatable. Their midfield has a lot of miles on it and they are not doing well at the moment. Their defence is suspect with Pique and Puyol out.
Oh so you can look in to the future and see that netherlands will lose to chile? So much negativity. Have some faith if you’re a dutch fan.
@ Mason – you’re so fucking dumb. We won’t beat chile means we won’t win… doesn’t mean we will lose. Did you see Chile toy with Germany… in Germany!?? We’re playing in South America, that should account for something. Besides, I’m giving our boys the day off after they beat Spain.
Wait.. Sam Wtf? Me dumb? How does “we won’t beat chile” mean “doesn’t mean we will lose”???
I’m sorry but you must be under the age of 10.
And yes I saw the Germany and chile game.. Did you see the spain and South Africa game? So South Africa will beat anybody then? It shows very clearly that you don’t really understand sports.
i wonder if VP is injuring himself more by this training:
Should Sneijder Be On The Plane?
Yes. Starting XI.
Yes, but only as a fringe player.
Total votes: 738
There is no threat because unfortunately we have no one to take his place.
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Liverpool’s biggest fan
Liverpool’s biggest fan14h ago-
strootman is injured, so he’s on the plane
2 : Like Reply
Pinto 1d ago-
Netherlands would be stupid not to include him in their squad. I’ll rather see him over rvp at the World Cup any day
1 : Like Reply
zach mouw21h ago-
Agree 100% man
1 : Like Reply
ikenna obi3h ago-
Who cares…..its not like they will be winning anything
0 : Like Reply
Nevaul Malabre1d ago-
With Strootman out who do they have to replace him?
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zach mouw21h ago-
It would be inexcusable not to include him. Our last two managers have been AWFUL but this would take it too a new level. He wasn’t in exceptional club form headed into south Africa either but he has a ridiculously good tournament then. He’s one of the best players if his generation and you can’t just judge him based off of a dip in club form which, in truth, hasn’t even been that severe. Besides, whos better? Van der vaart? Siem de jong? Klaasen? Pffft yeah right. I could see Wijnaldum but he’s still not Wesley sneijder.
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Gary Jackman11h ago-
I’m trying to understand Van Gaal’s motive for making a statement like this at this time when it is so close to selecting the World Cup team. Galatasaray like other teams may have talented players but the players need to mesh with each other. Does he have someone else in mind and is pressuring Wesley Sneijder to voluntary make it easier for him by withdrawing; after all the experience he has accumulated I think Sneijder would be crucial in the midfield for Holland at the World Cup.
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Berke Kadam8h ago-
He is still amazing, also now with Mancini, he became a goal-scorer attacking midfielder.
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Gary Jackman8h ago-
I cannot speak for Wesley Sneijder but this seems to be a slap in the face when it was lrasr expectsd.
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Gary Jackman8h ago-
I cannot speak forWesley Sneijder but this seems as a slap in the face when it was least expected; I’m wondering whether there is more to this statement than is seen on the surface.
Van Ginkel completes his first 90 minutes for Chelsea U21 after his injury return ….came close to scoring but rattled the crossbar .
“Celtic defender Van Dijk must go to the World Cup, says Dutch legend Adriaanse
yeap….no doubts about that……
our four CBs to WC should be Veltman, Van Dijk, Rekik, Vlaar. It obvious if in the first game we are exposed we can go with the backup against Chile and ascertain which combination is better.
I found out why van Persie is so injury prone…
For those of you who don’t know what I’m talking about, those quarter rep squats (With the pussy pad as us weight lifters call it) he was doing place some pretty cruel damage on the knee ligaments
You would think a professional athlete should at least know how to work out properly in order to strengthen and maintain their body.
Do you really think squats can be a cause of Van Persie injuries? Hes training with a very light weight. I use to do 100kgs squats every week and play football in an amateur team every weekend and i never get injuried. And see, my weight is 75kgs. Squats dont hurt anyone who is an athlete for years
Doing half assed squats like that put severe strain on your joints, regardless of the weight.
Undoubtedly he probably uses higher intensity when he can, but if he uses that kind of form his knee’s are going to be fried when he is older.
Squats cause injury if you’re not doing them the right way, the way Mr. van Persie is doing in that video is a prime example
His form looks perfect.
I am dreaming about a team with out kuyt since 2006.but still he is there,evryone expects that he will deliver when persie,Roben,or sneijder cannt deliver.it still remains a belive.
First time in 24 years liverpool look like a champion team.Their attack become more sharper when kuyt left.So the dutch team will be.
My long veiw is that i think Vlaar,devrij,kuyt will be slecetd and Blind will be slecetd as LB.We will concede goals and we will not be creating anything from wing or upfront as long as kuyt upfront.In the we would be careting less chances and so we wouldnt be scoring much,that time please dont blame these players.
What if RVN played insatead of kuyt in portugal VS dutch in 2006?
what if Roben played instead of kuyt vs russia in 2008EC??
What if Vaart played instead of kuyt vs spain in 2010 WC??
Coz all these time we had a strong team which lacked real scorer or creator upfront….All the failures in all these 3 turnaments still makes me sad.
i can neglect Euro 2012 ,coz the total team was bit crap especilaly midfeil lacked work rate.
dont worry tiju, kuyt isnt in the picture!
be glad you weren’t around in 2000-2002 (or at least you didn’t mention any frustration during that period in your comment), that period was worse, not to mention we should have won the WC in ’98 and perhaps even 1990.
Those are the 3 tournaments (pretending there was no WC in 2002, they had some exhibition going on in Asia that year to promote football there and make some people rich) that were most frustrating to me. Since 2000 I’ve gotten a better idea on how it works so it all gets a bit easier to swallow.
both generation underachived??Cocu generation due to injury etc for 2002 and lack of menatl stretgh,litlle bit tactical mistake from van gaal too.
But sneijder generation was simply capable of snathing 2008EC and 2010WC from spain….if kuyt was not there crunch matches.
Is Kongolo Oranje material? in ad.nl they say he might get a call.
I would say YES. He is fast, tall, good header, good passer, good football player in general. He can play left back and central defender. I think with Willems injured, he has a chance
Guys – can you please go to espnfc.com and vote for the starting XI for the world cup. Only RvP and Robben are potential candidates and they are running low on voting. Can you please go vote for them!!!
will do samny 🙂
YES MIGUEL! Contigo estoy.
Only alternatives I would have based on form for 3 positions:
From world soccer (Enzio Bakker):
“As the world of football continues to evolve rapidly, one of its traditional superpowers might be left behind. The Dutch national team doesn’t play as attractive as the famous teams of the past, while the Eredivisie is losing ground to the Portuguese, Turkish, Ukrainian and Russian leagues. Dutch clubs can’t compete financially and now face a difficult decision: keep on sliding down the European club’s ladder, or join forces with the money people and strike back.
Modern football doesn’t have a place for a low budget stepping stone anymore. There are only little stones and big rocks. As a proud footballing nation, the Dutch will not accept mediocrity. Something has to change, and more and more leading figures in Dutch football are calling for this change.”
Read more at http://www.worldsoccer.com/blogs/dutch-football-decline
Sneijder is still quick – i was surprised by this
indeed- it boggles my mind how people dismiss sneijder like he’s ‘finished goods’ when in fact he can still be the engine of our team
If I were LVG I would try to use as much as possible players that play outside Holland even if they are not regulars with their teams. It is clear that the quality of Eredivisie is way, way, way lower than England, Spain, Germany and Italy. Eredivisie players look like schoolboys. I would only bring me with a small number of players for a little experience in Brazil but I would only play them in case of emergency. I would even consider players such as Elia or Afellay even though I dislike both of them. Experience counts for much more than simple talents in WC. Guys like Van Dijk MUST absolutely be called and play, Verhaegh must play before any other eredivisie candidate, same goes for Buttner. We are talking about players who face Bayern, Dortmund, Chelsea etc. Even if they don’t play regularly like Buttner he still is training with very experienced players. If majority of our defense comes from PSV and Ajax which loses to Go Ahead Eagles type of teams expect Holland to be slaughtered by Spain and Chile, even Australia. Will see what happens.
I like Van Dijk, Verhaegh. Perhaps Elia. Not sure about Buttner or Afellay.
Elia hasn’t shown enough to go to the WC.
And I was always a big fan, but right now we have better options for the LW in Lens and Depay (or vPersie, Robben and even Sneijder, allthough the latter is probably not ideal unless vPersie can go deep there and overlap Sneijder, which means you need Hunter for the possible finish in the centre).
Perhaps I overrate the value of a known commodity, but I can’t see any of the top veteran attacking players (Robben, van Persie, Sneijder, VDV, Huntelaar) being left off the roster, and would expect at least three of them to start each game. The challenge as ever is to find a combination of those five that actually functions well as a unit, and to mix in the young players to get them some experience so that the entire 11 isn’t up for debate again in 2018.
Interesting article….I think our LB has to come from this group buttner, Kongolo, BMI, Pieters.Blind is definitely out of the picture given what happened to him vs France and if Van Gaal still persists in using him, he might as well dig his own grave.
I don’t know if people who wrote about the decline of Dutch football know the recent Netherland Soccer. The decline is not this generation the decline started from the generation that win the U21 Euro Champion. It’s Babel Drenthe Elia Affellay’s generation, we lost nearly the entire generation due to player leave immarturely. We do not have any players in our squad that is 27 28(the prime age now). This is where the problem started maybe even earlier. I think for this generation and incoming generations we are good and balanced but we do not have many standouts like RVP Sneijder VDV Robben. For this generation(players born after 89) we still can compete as long as the talents do not leave too early.
A Squad of
Strootman Van Ginkel
Willems Indi Veltman Janmaat
is solid to compete in the world after 3-5 years of development.
To sum it up, players of this generation like Bacuna, Indi is much better than earlier ones like Bouma, Tiendalli and Mathisen. Because they are much better talents. If our young players stay longer till age of 23 to 25 the Eredivisie will definitely be more competitive.
So the problem for me is if the youngsters can fight against the temptation of money for another 2 or 3 years if they learn the lesson from the last generation and if dutch clubs can pay more to youngsters just like what they did for the experienced players who came back from abroad for retirement. If these problems are solved there is no way Dutch soccer is in decline because the same youth system is there if we can produce talents for foreigners for the last generation(Suarez, Vertongen, Dembele, Tiote) we definitely can for ourselves. Actually I think nearly every team has more Dutch starters than anytime before in the last 5 years if I remember right.
Yes, I would say the trend is about 10 years. After WC 78, we peaked at Euro 88 (Euro 92 was not bad, unlucky), then peaked again at WC 1998 (Euro 2000 again unlucky) then Euro 2008-WC 2010. So we hope the next generation will peak at WC 2018-Euro 2020. I am still waiting for NT’s first elusive WC, and this 2014 WC is the last chance for RVP,Robben,Wes,VDV,Huntelaar generation. It looks like we are in transition again. I hope we can win this 2014 WC so bad……
You should consider that Eredivisie put more and more young players which symbolizes the decline. That’s why you have the IMPRESSION that there are more young talented players. But the facts prove the contrary as eredivisie clubs truly suck in europe. Most of the 90-95 born players from eredivisie wouldn’t even play in Russian clubs like Kuban, I can swear it to you.
In the squad you put, half of them will be good european players maybe, but as you said no Robben or Van Persie. The other half will be nothing, take a guy like Maher, he can go to Sporting for example, come back to Eredivisie cause not good enough for there (like Labyad), and in three years he’ll be playing in Antalyaspor or PAOK. It’s seriously what can happen.
Babel and Afellay were better talents than Depay and Maher. You can add Drenthe, Emanuelson, Maduro, De Ridder, Aissati, Medunjanin…Half of them signed to big clubs but didn’t convince, other half is lost in europe, that’s what will probably happen to your squad of 90-95 players.
That’s why I don’t agree with people saying that the generation 90-95 is better than 85-90. Especially as last generations won 2x EC-21 while the current one failed. Only time will prove it.
I agree though about having more choice for defenders than in the last generation. Which doesn’t mean having better defenders
A lot of people have the attitude that the generation they watched is always the best but that is simply just not true. I definitely think Depay is going to have a better future than Elia and Afellay if he leave maturely.
Eredivisie still produce good players in the last three years but most of them are foreigners because of the overspending in the last three years. That’s why now a lot of clubs are in debt and why KNVB has such strict rules on clubs’ finance. Furthermore, foreign players leave at a more mature age than Dutch ones because a lot of them spend several years in other leagues then come to Eredivisie so they have more games played before they leave.
To name a few foreign players who are of our lost generation’s age: Sébastien Pocognoli,Marko Arnautovic,Thomas Vermaelen,Marcus Berg,Ragnar Klavan,Keisuke Honda,Luis Suárez,Nordin Amrabat,Cheik Tioté,Moussa Dembélé,Bryan Ruiz,Balázs Dzsudzsák,Pontus Wernbloom,Héctor Moreno,Sergio Romero,Andreas Granqvist,Dries Mertens,Ahmed Musa,Jan Vertonghen,Aras Özbiliz,Rasmus Elm,Maya Yoshida,Toby Alderweireld,Ola Toivonen,Marcelo,Wilfried Bony,Nacer Chadli
If all of them are dutch that forms a squad that can compete with any good team in the world. We still have the same youth system as 3 years ago. Now young players are changed to dutch. If they all of them stay a little longer in Eredivise, the league would be stronger and they will be better players just as the above players I listed. Netherland still has one of the best youth training system in the world. The only problem they need to solve is stop young players from leaving early.
Furthermore, football is a cycle thing, you can not require every generation to have a Robben, a Sneijder, a Van Persie because even country like Brazil has its downs in 2010. As long as we have generations of good players we will be fine and we will have the generation that got several excellent talents in the long run (the one that win two U17 championships). So I will laugh out any talk about the decline of Dutch soccer. Some even say Netherland is the next Hungary that is just naive.
Babel over Depay is yet to be seen. Babel was faster, but was always pretty blind.
Comparing some attacking Eredivisie stats for both:
* Babel 5617 minutes/32 goals+assists = 1 g/a every 175 minutes
* Depay 3164 minutes/27 goals/assists = 1 g/a every 117 minutes
Eredivisie was better when Babel started, but when he came back he was not that impressive either with his output. One could also say that the supporting cast of Ajax was better when Babel started. Babel was very young when making his debut for Oranje, also due to his physique, but after that advantage had no real extra gears to make the difference on a higher level. As I said, he was a bit blind. His biggest mistake IMO was that he never understood his own profile. For me, he is a second striker in a 4-4-2 formation. Not a pure winger or striker.
Depay also has one of the highest keypass rates in Eredivisie with 2,6 per game. His defensive contribution is not too shabby either, though he should stop giving away dangerous turnover balls on his own half. All this is build on a pretty professional frame (dedication) and paired with more than decent mental strength.
Depay has more silk in his creative passing, let alone better vision. Also his shot could become a true weapon long term (Babel has a hard shot, not an effective shot). His cross might be better also. The question I have concerning Depay is how his relative lack of speed is going to play out at the highest level. His ball handling also lacks a certain refinement. This results in him having arguments with the ball at times or making weird misplaced passes at times.
Preliminary squad for the U17 Euro:
* Hidde ter Avest (FC Twente Voetbalacademie)
* Donny van de Beek (Ajax)
* Anthony Berenstein (FC Utrecht)
* Leon Bergsma (Ajax)
* Steven Bergwijn (RJO PSV/EHV)
* Justin Bijlow (Feyenoord Academy)
* Stan van Bladeren (Ajax)
* Laros Duarte (Sparta Rotterdam)
* Delano Grootenhuis (FC Twente Voetbalacademie)
* Danny van Haaren (Feyenoord Academy)
* Erwin Heidekamp (RVO/GC FC Groningen)
* Ruben de Jager (FC Twente Voetbalacademie)
* Guido Janssen (FC Utrecht)
* Joris Klein Holte (Vitesse)
* Julian Lelieveld (Vitesse)
* Karim Loukili (FC Utrecht)
* Rick van der Meer (Feyenoord Academy)
* Dani van der Moot (RJO PSV/EHV)
* Abdelhak Nouri (Ajax)
* Yanick van Osch (RJO PSV/EHV)
* Bilal Ould-Chikh (FC Twente Voetbalacademie)
* Segun Owobowale (ADO Den Haag)
* Kenneth Paal (RJO PSV/EHV)
* Mauro Savastano (Ajax)
* Jari Schuurman (Feyenoord Academy)
* Marlon Slabbekoorn (Feyenoord Academy)
* Jan-Willem Tesselaar (AZ)
* Keziah Veendorp (RVO/GC FC Groningen)
* Calvin Verdonk (Feyenoord Academy)
* Wellington Verloo (Vitesse)
* Ezra Walian (Ajax)
* Teun van Zweeden (Ajax)
I think this talk about the decline of Dutch football is pure bullshit.
How can you talk about decline when the Dutch reached the final only 4 years ago?. I know the Eredivisie isn’t doing too great lately but I wouldn’t talk about a decline just yet.
Actually I see a Dutch revolution going on with many former players involved coaching, developing players. Cruyff is more involved with Ajax, Hiddink now with PSV and will help a lot when in command of the NT, LVG going to an EPL club will help at least 1 or 2 Dutch players.
I do see a lot of talents in the Eredivisie they might not be super stars yet but I believe they can be in the future. Depay, Wijnaldum, Willems, Clasie, Van Ginkel, Van Aanholt, Klaasen, De Vrij, Bruma, Rekik, Kongolo, Boetius, Cillesen, etc…Afellay, Lens will still be around and RVP, Robben might even reach the next tournament so just stop all the negativity and believe more in your team.
We all believe in the team but the way in which football works now has made the eredivisie more irrelevant. Players who have one good season leave and are very rarely replaced leading to younger replacements or sideways transfers. From what I see the problem stems from players not going to big teams Eg Ajax /Psv who compete in Europe before they leave. My argument would be with someone like bony /van ginkel who left and aren’t playing at a high level. They could both have strengthened Ajax very much. I don’t know what to say about Maher and Psv other than they have wij as a cam but most strootman and van bommel and so have no like for like replacements promoted or scouted
Well said Miguel.. Too much negativity in this blog. It makes me sick, and to a point where I don’t even want to read these comments anymore. There’s no belief what so ever. I bet the same people with all these negative comments were commenting like this before the 2010 tournament.
It’s soccer/ football people…. Anything can happen. Have faith in this team…
Yes, it’s an easy guess why some of the more negative commenters here are in a sad state: gambling addiction. It changes everything in the way a person thinks about sport.
Truth: If they were so smart, they’d be cleaning out the bookmakers.
But they’re not, or they wouldn’t be here whinging, they’d be too busy getting rich and enjoying it. Only the pikers and losers tout so desperately and negatively on message boards. It’s not hard to see the difference between them and the rest of us… “fans.”
Well said 🙂
Did anyone hear about our friend Rami??? He passed away yesterday:(!!!! I am shocked!!
OH Jesus….@Alaa u know him personally??what was the reaosn,he is the second after our Finnister….Finnister is still a big loss for this blog..Finnister could nt see a dutch crowning in his life at WC…So sad…
This is really shocking and depressing! Didn’t know we lost Finnster either! double blow! 🙁 🙁
Ramy April 1, 2014 at 8:42 pm
Buttner has been playing well, again !
too bad about the injury. let’s see how long he’s gonna stay out for.
🙁 🙁 :'(
I personally lost his soul i think,i am bit responsible for it.
This is shocking..RIP Rami! A big loss indeed! 🙁
Terrible news Alaa. My condolence to family, friends and everybody who knew him. I am just reading back some of his comments on the blog.
Wow, darn…. what happened? Does anyone know?
Some idiotic, short visioned Journalist has to write some thing for their daily living,that is wat my opinion about the article of dutch decline in football.
May be we could say that selection pattern of the new coaches are not so good,instead of looking natural dutch intelligent players they go for more physical players with lesser brain.
Offcourese some intelligent skills players are done form childhood due to over food and video games and computers.but this is a global pheomenon not only dutch.
talents are there offcourse,but the level of intellgence of new players is low compared to older ones.
We cannt compare with Afellay Vs Vanpersie/Sneijder.one is utter idiot and other is einstein of football if not wizards or magicians in foot ball.
Most of the time my predictions get right because it is based on psychology of players and coach.Definitly not based on skills and talents.
You can give a wonderful team to a shit egostical coach and u can loose in WC by stupidity of one man..thats how football is.For me Coach is the real captain,
Terrible news about Rami… How did you find out about this Alaa? How old was he?
This is a link Rami posted back in 2013:
I do not have Facebook, so I can not explore the content, but maybe people who have a Facebook account can look for more information and if so, maybe leave a message on behalf of this website.
Is it him ?
Alaa came with the news and is maybe better able to be certain on this one. Not enough was shared on this website about himself to be sure. The link was about the Lebanon based Oranje fans, so if this Rami belonged to that circle I can imagine this being him.
Wow..thats very sad. Such a pitty he didnt even get to see our boys march out on the field in South America.
Does anyone know any personal details about him? how did he die, age, nationality, accupation, which Ere team he supported etc
He’s Lebanese just like me…. that’s all I know
he was fighting illness in hospital and left this world yesterday – facebook.com
Apparently he was a crazy dutch fan!
Condolence to Rami’s family and friend
We will definately gonna miss Rami in this blog~~Amen~~
My condolence to Rami’s family and friend.
The rivalry between Netherland’s and Belgium’s is heating up. Check out doeme80’s comment and mneod’s response http://www.fifa.com/worldcup/teams/team=43960/comments.html.
ESPN also has a short article about NT world cup kit (second only to Brazil in terms of instant recognition across the globe) at http://espnfc.com/news/story/_/id/1597538/netherlands-world-cup-kit-history.
Wow, condolences to Rami’s family and friends….
RIP our friend Rami, dutch fan forever
for those who like chemistry between player:
Robben: Netherlands need Sneijder at World Cup
really comforting to be reminded of past glories
Sorry guys, I was at work all day long today and I was not able to reply to your questions here!!
All I know is through the “official page of oranje fans in lebanon” I just saw this update on my facebook yesterday before I went to bed at night. it was the other admin with rami in the group his name is sherif el housseini he wrote: “Dear friends our great friend rami najjar has left us by body but he is still with us in soul (god bless his souol he wrote in arabic), then he continued “holland will miss you, nshallah holland wins we dedicate everything to your soul”
so when i saw that i asked sherif what happened becuase i couldnt believe it i was shocked, he said he was in the hospital fighting an illness. thats all he said. so i asked him to post the last thing rami had posted on the page on facebook so he reposted it and it was from march 15th, it was a small peice in arabic about van gaal and the world cup and he seemed not to have too much hope that oranje can make it in the world cup.
thats all I know guys, and I am really shocked. someone asked about his age, i wanna say he is his thirties he is a young guy. god bless his soul.
R.I.P Rami. God bless his soul. 🙁
My condolences to his family. Did he have children 🙁 ?
Jan: “Anyway, Sneijder….one needs to change the team around so Sneijder can deliver. I see him in the Cabaye/Pirlo role. Deeplying, next to Nigel de Jong.”
Borrowing this idea we can go full Juve after the WC or 2015 and go with:
Willems and Janmaat hoovering on the sides. Ginkel and Strootman in the Pogba/Vidal role. Sneijder in the Pirlo role. Kongolo is already the best defender of Feyenoord. Veltman is a question mark as we have to see how van Dijk and Bruma develop. Vlaar with experience gets the nod as long as Rekik but also Ake are still a bit immature (Rekik strolling out of his box with the ball at his feet against FC Groningen). Krul coming back strong after a mediocre season from him where he did not really developed.
Just a fun idea to toy with.
I may say Lens would excel in this formation as a right wingback , wouldn’t he ?
I have always loved that idea, but I do not know if Lens has the discipline to go back and forth on the flank all the time. There is a certain nonchalance in his game that would make me nervous to ask this of him. A new Dirk Kuyt like Janmaat is cut out for it, though he will never be as good as Lens with pinpoint interventions, taking balls off attackers for fun. Lens is also faster than Janmaat. It will never happen though.
I think we should stop with Robben, RVP and Sneijder after this world cup. Even if they can still perform good 2-3 years more with their club, I don’t have the feeling that they would bring NT to the top again being old. They started very young (2004-2006), reached the WC finale, missed it, does someone expect them to do it 4 or 8 years later ? In general that doesn’t happen.
Van Basten took the decision to ignore Seedorf in 2006, Clarence still performed some years more with Milan, now the question : Would Holland have reached the WC finale in 2010 with Seedorf on the field ? Not sure.
Better to work on a new team after this WC, even if starting with young players, 2016 will probably be too short, but maybe 2018 or 2020.
We can compare the situation to France : Missed WC 2006 finale, had hard times in 2008 and 2010, did a bit better in 2012, now will probably reach 1/4, and I believe France will be the main contender for 2016 with Germany.
That’s how it can be for Holland : Missed 2010 WC finale, had hard times in 2012 and will have in 2014, can do a bit better in 2016, and can be a serious contender for 2018/2020.
That needs to build a new team.
How about this title on all major newspaper on July 14 2014: “Robben, RVP and Sneijder retired from Holland’s international duty after shocking the world football experts by delivering Holland the first elusive World Cup champion”?
Seedorf is a special case. Back in 1996 he was already causing trouble on two fronts. Not only involved with the group making a point about the Ajax money distribution while being on country duty, but also thinking that he should play 10 instead of Bergkamp. Seedorf has never understood his place and paired that with one of the most annoying lethargic attitudes I have seen from a player when playing for Oranje. There is a lot of revisionism about this player.
Totally different from RVP, Sneijder and especially Robben. When van Gaal benched RvP for Huntelaar at the start of his spell vs Belgium van Gaal was amazed about his reaction and worked himself back in the line up, even became captain. Sneijder has been marginalized by van Gaal, but for me he has not crossed the line anywhere. Robben is always fired up when playing for Oranje. For me it is not about age, it is about players that want to do their best when playing for the NT and giving their all. Robben is an example in this (as is Kuyt and why he is still there) and I want that attitude to spill over to the new generation. I want them to get infected with. Robben is a great role model if anything else. How he sat there next to Rekik against France explaining some details. Wonderful sight. Made me proud. Why waste that?
Seedorf can not be compared with these 3 players, or maybe only a little bit with Sneijder, who could start to cause trouble when he is selected but not in the first 11. His latest game for Gala indicates that he cares quite a lot. Was the only player according to Gala fans that really tried to advance Gala. The holy fire is not gone.
2 things about the France analogy.
* First of all France is a much bigger country. They can be a bit more wasteful with the gems they have produced and who are in trouble to find themselves again. Bigger country’s have more options. Netherlands must be economical with the once in a generation players they produce.
* Second of all, the cycle can be read differently than how you read it. The cycle could also be pinpointed at 1998 in their own country with Zidane scoring big goals in the final all the way to 2006 when he stopped. After that France had trouble finding themselves again. From the view of a outsider (me) there were Dutch 1996 scenes going on with ego over team players dictating the culture in the squad and now this is reversed with the influx of new eager blood. However I do not really see ego over team behavior with Sneijder, RVP and Robben. There is nothing really rotten or toxic going on (as far as I can see).
2012 was players not knowing their boundaries, walking over the coach after their own bad form lead to a loss against Denmark. However the players did not walk over the coach to revolt against discipline itself, but because they wanted to play so badly. Huntelaar, vd Vaart, Nigel de Jong. Ambition drove them, not being blazé with Oranje. In some way a bit disarming to see players wanting to play so badly. A new coach should love that, only being cautious they do not think they can get things the way they want and with van Gaal there is little chance that will happen. Hiddink idem dito.
IMO the 2 players we must build on are Strootman and van Ginkel. I wished Netherlands would evolve towards the way Japan tries to play football, but that is not going to happen anytime soon. So that’s why the Juve model or City model are interesting to look at. Both use 2 box to box players in midfield. I would still blend in the “oldies”, but from a point of view that Stroot and van Ginkel always fit in.
Here is what is crazy about the Dutch NT: We are a few weeks from selection time and maybe only six players are certain to be on the squad–and the starting 11 is almost completely up in the air! Unbelievable. I don’t expect much cohesion once the tourney starts, and that spells trouble for the Orange.
key to beatig spain….. pressing busquets
Thank you for the article. I recalled Brazil did a very well similarly job in Confederation final, disrupting Spain’s well oil midfield machine. This bring up a good question: who are our midfielders best that can do this job? Nigel De Jong is our most experienced DM but he is a bit slow which affects his accuracy in tackling (which may lead to yellow card).
you know one of the main reasons holland couldn’t get a footing in the final 2010, sneijder didn’t press busquets, the defenders split to the side, and busquets comes in the center like a 3rd defender, sneijder didn’t cover him, allowing spain attacks. strootman was perfect for the role, now we have less people who can pressure wisely
players who can press him are klaasen johnathan de guzman, players who are used to pressing good, sneijder won’t due period
this is an interesting finding….but dutch coaches cannt think abt a team with out sneijder…thats the sad point.
@ Gabriel……for those who like chemistry between player:
Robben: Netherlands need Sneijder at World Cup
IT WILL A BE REPEAT OF EC 2012
As what laurent mentioned about Sedoorf and Van Basten’s decision to ignore him in 2006. we have the same scenario on our hands here.
IMO Robben is looking for those Sneijder’s pass similar to the WC2010 final, a second chance to redeem himself this time. Robben is simply our key player this time. Sneijder still has a month and a half to better himself.
2010-2014. It never happened in 2012 why do you think it will happen in 2014. just curious????????????????
In 2012 Wes he was coming into Euro 2012 following a poor season on both a personal level and for his club. He spent much time on injury, and came into Euro not in his best shape regarding fitness. He fell out of favor in Inter as the coach deemed him not fit into the team’s tactic plus the club asking him to take a pay cut. There was a lot of stuff happening. This time he is a starter at Galatasary. LVG has given him the ultimatum by telling him that his current form not good enough. If he cannot improve his play then perhaps he does not deserve to go to Brazil (Klassen is my choice to replace him). There is no more excuse this time around compare to when he was with Inter.
I watched him vs on the Asian and I watched him vs France. Trust me there was nothing special about his performance.I mean vs France Progba, Matudi and Cabaye simply trolled and outclassed him. People believe he can get back to fitness in one month but then there is conditioning factor in the Brazil which will make thing more miserable for him. Maybe Stijnis (OranjeAussie) can elaborate more on the humid condition and the effects as it happens in the Melbourne and Queensland region.
* Asian tour
* Asian tour
or a repeat of 2010 wc you never know
sums up his tactics.
wilson just curius do you REALLY think that VDV can make a better job than Sneijder? Have you see vaart lately, he is a shadow player, BIG fittnes problems, it is clearly that Sneijder is not at his best but a limb sneijder is better than the current vaart.
Do you REALLY think we can trust all the creativity to some guy who is in the bottom of the bundesliga???
Also Sneijder has some goods momments this year, unlike vaart who didnt playe CL or EL, please vaart is a finnish player dealt with it.
Sneijder can still learn the pirlo trade since he has some good long range pass, the only thing he need to learn is to defend, altought I dont think he will learn it
sneijder’s threat stops with a through ball or a lon range or blind shooting,or some one heads from his freekick.while Vaart combines with Roben ,RVP lenz with 2 ruuners in midfeild gives us more fluid and dangerous team which make us capable of beating any strong team when defense is stable.
while with sneijder we need to wait for individual actions.it may click or may not ,but it doesnt click 9/10 when we face strong teams Examples france game recent one,Spain game WC2010, etc etc.
Vaart Vs sneijder
On ball skills
Long range shoots
Vaart=8(vaart is more sharper)
Sneijder=8 or less he him self shoots instead of making it in to more secure goal.
Sneijder=8..Sneijder seems strong in this area,though i prefer a warrior who sacrifices his life for team,where vaart stand head and shoulder above Roben and sneijder.
this is what varat vs snijedr
Sniejder plays in a better team and under a betetr coach so he has some advantages but ,oranage national team benefits Vaart than sneijder as of now.
To add my point at least United and Chelsea still want Sneijder, who want Vaart? Ajax? EVEN Klassen is better than currenntly vaart!!
but vaart is better than sneijder.thats the fact
so whats good guys from a stand point of statistics holland need to press and press wisely meaning stamina is very important.
——–bmi—-nigel de jong—veltman——
oops not really sneijder i try to get creative but in reality i cant wait for frank de boer to be coach he was assistant in 2010 once he left we went downhill
so anyone have links for preliminary squad for ecuador friendly i have an unconfirmed list i have hard time believing from this list is some intriguing possibilities
gk: vorm, cillessen, krul
def:van der wiel, vlaar, pieters, janmaat, de vrij, blind, verhaugh, veltman, gouweleeuw
mid:van der vaart, sneijder, robben, nigel de jong, schaars, clasie, depay, boetius, klassen
attack:lens kuyt huntelaar
so obviously rvp is injured and won’t return yet, but he’s gonna be there of this team, i forsee an unlikely team forming.
really if this is true for left back all you have is blind vs pieters
when u have schaars and vaart u have a turtle midfeild,offcourse we might get suck vs speedy one if this is going to happen
Dutch has an amazing possibilties of winning 2014WC if they stand mentally strong.i mean they should have an attitude of we dont fear anything even DEATH,have a laugh vs death,.Laugh vs the roaring fans of brazil.be the gutsy boys ,no matter how intimidating the opponent are HAVE THE courage LIKE king David ,have spirit of Mighty Jesus,No one will stand in the way of dutch.Fight like David..you will win vs Goliaths.
The mighty Jesus can cover your weakness and HE will,But only problem is he cannt stand sin,you will be fooled/humiliated if you challenge HIM and go for fight vs HIM.
lets wish our players has heart of Jesus,i mean like HE died for Tiju.let them have such attitude towards their team mates.Go for the battle with a better mindset better than Gladiators.
Let sneijder says to vaart that Brother you are an awesome talent which didnt get much opportunity,lets work together to redeem our stamina,let sneijedr say to van gaal that play Vaart as first choice,you consider me as second choice.lets act like strong MAN.
@ gabriel….. I cant remember saying that vaart is better than sneijder or sneijder over vaart…….the question is here was form and who is a better team WHICH vaart as proved to be on many occassion. I wonder what if he would have played in final vs spain 2010. I think somebody did a statistical review for both in one of the earlier blogs in terms of their apprarence and goal scored…..I think it was you are a joke. not sure……. it bit pity that strootman got injured which has given him the lifeline otherwise van gaal would have slammed the door on his face. I have mentioned this before would better if they selected both to be used as super subs
Sneijder in a more deeper role so that our strikers dont become static as in the past or on the LW.
vaart as play marker as he did in 2012.
if they are selected
we really cant afford to play with both, so you have to pick one. Since we have none AM in good form for the momment
So i see people are trying to figure out if sneijder is good enough or not for the team for brazil. well here is a series of articles written on the tactics Holland used at the last two tournaments with anecdotes about sneijder highlighted
Denmark vs Holland
Sneijder was still the game’s star man and recorded some amazing statistics – most passes (62, next highest 55), most passes played in the final third (37, next highest 21) and most tellingly, most chances created (10, next highest 5). Denmark defended well in the penalty box, but simply couldn’t shut him down. The top two pass combinations in the game were Ibrahim Afellay to Sneijder, and Sneijder to Afellay – showing how much Sneijder was playing towards the left flank.
Germany vs Holland
The first goal highlighted this brilliantly. De Jong started off marking Ozil in a central zone, but ends up being dragged to a left-back position. Van Bommel tracks Khedira, who also moves towards that side of the pitch. Therefore, the entire central midfield zone has been opened up for Schweinsteiger – with Sneijder miles away. Schweinsteiger gets the ball, and slipsin Gomez, who spun and finished excellently. This was an isolated incident, but it had been coming.
Sneijder had his quietest game of the tournament, drifting into that position occupied by the three Portuguese central midfielders
World Cup 2010
Spain were able to keep the ball and played out from the back rather easily, for Busquets frequently had time to look up and play a good pass.
Holland surprisingly didn’t respond to this by trying to close him down (Sneijder was in a good position to do so) but they did try and recreate it themselves.
So Pros and Cons of sneijder based on what we know about him
Long Range Passing
Most effective with 3 fast players in front of him.
Meant for a counter attacking style
Quick feet, very agile.
Doesn’t defend, press or slide tackles
Stamina is weak
Shoots when he should pass
no break away speed
loses aerial duels.
best positions in which formations
in order to place sneijder on the dutch national team.
Realistically the formation should be 4231
I’m kind of tired of this sneijder thing, as much as i am a fan of him and huntelaar, right now they both dont belong on the team. Van Gaal is right, sneijder is gonna need to up his defensive contribution in pressing, if not we are going to be outnumbered in midfield and get murdered, the way we got outnumbered against france, against germany, spain.
the reason the 4-2-3-1 is popular is because it is an even distribution of 5 midfielders that crowds it up to give a team the upper hand. when we play with sneijder it’s a 4-2-4 system. He will not track back at all.
All this pessimism but people don’t realize we have a team that can win the world cup. If we play organized team tactics where we press up the pitch. Have a variety of attacks coming down both flanks and the middle, combination play between robben, rvp, vdv, who have a great chemistry in their triangle (ideally adam maher would be perfect but he’s out of form)
From that article:
“If not for Robin van Persie he would be the undisputed Dutch ‘number nine’.”
Mohamed Moallim is a good writer but this is not true. Against Germany van Gaal needed another striker profile and Kuyt played the full game. Huntelaar stayed on the bench. Lens would have been a serious rival for the striker position as well, certainly now Depay is a bit of a favorite of van Gaal.
Both coach tactics and internal competition would not have made this a cut out thing. In current form maybe a bit, but van Gaal can always surprise. What if Chili presses us back like they did to Germany? Does it make sense to play with a player who is only excellent in the opponents box or with a player like Lens who would be a force on the counter? Spain idem dito. Pretty dominant ball possession country’s that could leave tap in masters ineffective.
The only reason that vGaal kept Hunter out of some friendlies (and easy qualiiers) is that he didn’t want Huntelaar to reach the same record as vPersie in the all time oranje scorers.
This way he gives his selection a boost.
Not that I beieve Hunter is better than vPersie.
Lenz and Wijnaldum are like bulldozers…they dont fall easily,and they lions when they attack.though they might sleep when off the ball.
wijnaldum bulldozer?? I wonder if you see this??
That doesnt look like a bulldozer to me, maybe you talk about other wijnaldum??
i didnt mean in physical size,they are extreamly strong and easily would keep many defenders at bay,this is not the case with maher,boetius,afellay,elia etc or even depay is not strong as both…..
I see people here talking about lateral backs, wingers etc. for me that’s not so important. I don’t see a big difference of level between Willems, Emanuelson, Blind, Pieters or PVA. Blind and Pieters are more defencive profiles, Willems, Emanuelson and PVA more attacking but that’s all, they are all more or less balanced in my opinion. Nothing really crucial for me to play with Emanuelson or Blind.
Same for wingers, I don’t see a big difference between Depay, Lens, Elia etc.
But what will be very important and crucial is the midfield. Changing a player like VDV for Klaassen can change the face of a game. Negativly. With VDV on the field you definitly increase your chances to score.
Corner and free kicks become dangerous (remember how they were spoiled by Sneijder against France), VP receives more the ball, VDV will take AT LEAST 3 dangerous long shots in a game. That happens every time he is on the field, especially with NT.
With Klaassen you don’t have these things, he has better lungs than VDV, runs more, but that’s really the only thing he is better for. Klassen pass quality is miles away from VDV one, he doesn’t kick any free kick or corner kick, doesn’t take long shots, is a less good dribbler…And that has nothing to do with their form with clubs, that’s just how good they can play football or not.
Remember Russia 2008, who offered us to play more than 90 min ? Sneijder was shooting a lot but couldn’t make the difference. It’s VDV who took a brillant free kick for Van Nistelrooy. Same against France that same tournam ent, 8 minutes, really good corner kick for Kuyt. 1-0.
Even against Italy I don’t remember exactly but I think it was him on the first free kick where RVN scored after no ?
Portugal 2012, brillant shot after 15 min, 1-0.
So now find me games with NT where VDV played and nothing happened, I only remember WC 2010 against Denmark and Japan but he was playing LM and him and Sneijder were disturbing each other.
When he is AM, he almost always score or give an assist.
LAURENT very unfortunatly people dont see this…
correction in the euro 2008 Sneijder gave the assist to nistelrooy not vaart
Sneijder shot and Van Nistelrooy touched the ball, but the free kick was originally from Vaart.
I remember Jean Michel Larqué (one of the main french football speakers) saying that VDV corner kicks and free kicks were perfect, cause always relapsing between the six meters point and the keeper. Very hard to manage for a keeper to know if he should go to the ball or no.
People still don’t realize how much we scored thanks to that
Just watch that and see from what come all the chances we created :
With the players that we have right now, this team can not play 4-3-3!! Defensively our players are NOT good enough and they are very inexperienced. A formation of 4-2-3-1 will suit the team much better, because that way we can be more solid in the back having two defensive midfielders.
Vab Der Wiel Vlaar Veltman/(Indi) Pieters
De Jong Blind
Robben Sneijder Lens
Maybe this starting 11 is a little bit to defensive for a lot of people but lets not forget that we are playing Spain in the first game of the group and we all know that’s gonna be extremely tough…..so solid defense and i’m sure we can do some damage up top with Robben, Van Persie and Sneijder.
HUP HOLLAND HUP!!!
also i have seen a lot of comments above that they have van ginkel on the starting 11….if van ginkel is fit enough which i doubt that very much, he hasn’t played for chelsea a single game after his injury and we all know van gaals policy, you don’t play for your club, you don’t get called!!