Nigel de Jong not written off yet….

Nigel de Jong showed himself again, last week against PSV. He copped a knock on his toe in the first 5 minutes and that injury will most likely stop him from playing Milan’s opening game in the Serie A this weekend and might even keep him grounded for the second leg vs PSV.

The stocky midfielder has been criticised a lot on our blog and in the Dutch media, but in Germany, England and now in Italy there is tremendous respect for the former Ajax player. And I think that he deserves it. I personally have a lot of respect and admiration for De Jong. Partly, because he was launched as a creative midfielder, who was transformed into a disciplined, hardworking destroyer.

In Oranje, I rather saw Van der Vaart on De Jong’s position. Obviously, more football with Raf. And we already had Mark van Bommel. But I had a lot of admiration for De Jong’s career and I felt that the tremendous criticism he copped over the Xabi Alonso kick and the Ben Arfa leg injury were exaggerated.

I repeat: the kick in the face of Demy de Zeeuw was worse (for the victim) than the Xabi kick but that was never an item as it didn’t happen versus a Spaniard. De Jong clearly had eye for the ball and did not hit Alonso on purpose. Why on Earth would he do that (Wasn’t it in the first 2o mins of the game?). The Ben Arfa situation wasn’t even a foul. Just an unlucky situation. Not nice for Ben Arfa, but Robin van Persie had a similar situation, from a friendly against Italy. Are we now repeating constantly that the Italian defender was a criminal? No, it was an unlucky situation.

With Mark van Bommel retired and with our midfielders in a shaky position ( Fer, Van Ginkel, Strootman, Clasie…either not in great form or just moved to another club…always a risk), it is conceivable that LVG will want to try out De Jong once more.


Louis inspired Nigel….


Because against Andorra and Hungary, it’s all good to play with a midfield with Maher, De Guzman and Van Ginkel but against Brazil, Germany or Portugal, you might want to use De Jong as destroyer… Right?

Lets sing the praise of this un-Dutch midfielder….

Nigel De Jong said goodbye to Manchester on the final day of the summer transfer window, much to the regret of many City fans. De Jong was a firm favourite during his three-and-a-half year stint at the club and he will always be respected by the City supporters for the total commitment he showed in a blue shirt.

The disappointment over his sale was palpable but his new adventure at AC Milan has begun. Here, we look back over his life and assess his impact on the footballing world.

De Jong was raised in Amsterdam-West, an area of Holland home to many immigrant families, particularly those like the De Jong family who are of Surinamese descent. Nigel’s father, Jerry, was a player at PSV Eindhoven, representing Holland on three occasions, however, he had little involvement in the De Jong household where young Nigel was considered the man of the house. With his father absent from home, and his mother suffering from a kidney complaint that frequently saw her in hospital, he assumed responsibility for his four other siblings, an experience he feels made him the man he is today.

“I had to grow up quickly. My childhood wasn’t easy. We didn’t have a lot and we had to fight for everything we got. There was no time to play around and not a lot of spare cash. When you grow up in that kind of area you can go one of two ways, and one is on the streets. I don’t want to make it too dramatic but there were other kids from my neighbourhood who got into a bad way of life. I’ve seen friends die from being on the streets.”

De Jong started his career as a forward; a number 10 seeking to influence the game high up the pitch. In 2003, he went to Highbury as an 18 year old with Ajax in a Champions League match, scoring his first senior goal with a brilliant lob into the top corner. The difference between the young player at Ajax and the De Jong operating in today’s game is staggering. It was a move masterminded by Huub Stevens, his coach at Hamburg, who, after signing De Jong in January 2006 for a fee of less than £1 million, moved him to the role we now associate him with.

“I was always a striker, or a No10. Even in my last year at Ajax I was on the right side of attack. But then I moved to Germany and the Hamburg coach, Huub Stevens, said: ‘Listen, this might be a surprise but I’m going to turn you into a defensive midfielder so trust me.’

“It was a shock because I’d always played in a more glamorous position but I’d always admired that kind of player. I looked at it like this: Zinedine Zidane couldn’t have done his job without Claude Makélélé. Andy Cole and Dwight Yorke couldn’t have scored those goals without Roy Keane. Fernando Redondo, Patrick Vieira, Fernando Hierro; a team cannot operate without these players. It’s about discipline and doing a job for the team. So let the other players fight it out to be the main man. My job is to defend then give the ball to the players who have the creativity.”

nigel karate trap

Bruce Lee? Jackie Chan? No. Louis van Gaal….


It was a positional shift that paid off handsomely as De Jong gradually forged a reputation as one of the best defensive midfielders in Europe, with his nickname Rasenmäher (the Lawnmower) given as a reference to his style of play that mows down all before him.

It was January 2009, with City struggling for form under the guidance of Mark Hughes, that the club payed £18 million for a player with only 6 months left on his contract. Such was the importance of the acquisition, City paid over-the-odds to ensure he wasn’t snapped up by the other big clubs who were circling. He joined a side far from the finished article, with huge disparity between home and away form meaning City were struggling in the league. They had also been knocked out of both cup competitions by lower league sides, on penalties to Brighton in the League Cup, and smashed 3-0 at home by Nottingham Forest. Expectations were high but performances were far from impressive.

He made his debut in a home win against Newcastle but City’s patchy form continued soon after, picking up only 4 points from the remaining 9 away matches. For a player used to success with Ajax and Hamburg it was probably a shock to the system, having habitually finished in the top 3 at his previous clubs. But De Jong wanted to be part of the long-term future of the club.

“The results have been mixed, especially the difference between the home form and the away form. We need to improve on that but it’s a beautiful club and it’s been good for me to see the club in a, quotes, ‘bad season’ and experience the downside, knowing there are successful years to come. The success was never going to come straightaway. I knew that from the start. But I met the chairman [Khaldoon Al Mubarak] and he told me his plans.

“He told me about the expectations of the club and the way some people expected them to take the club to the top in the first six months. It doesn’t work like that, of course. It takes time. Everyone seems to think the new owners are pumping in all this money without using their minds but I talked to the board and Khaldoon and they are trying to build something with a mind behind it. You just have to have patience and work your bollocks off to get it right.”

No one could deny that De Jong was true to his word.

Living in Bowden, the palatial Cheshire suburb home to many of Manchester’s footballers, he quickly settled in a city he felt was overwhelmingly blue.

“There are so many more Blues than Reds. If I take a cab, the driver is a City fan. If I go to the shopping centre, all I see are City shirts. I was astonished when I first arrived because everyone was a Blue and I was asking everyone: ‘How does that work? Manchester United are the biggest club in the world, aren’t they?’

“People would explain to me: ‘That’s just a global thing, the real workers’ club is Manchester City.’ And it’s true, it’s a working club, and the people in Manchester can relate to this club because they are working people. They are very proud of it. That’s why Manchester City is so big locally – not worldwide maybe, but definitely locally.”

The following season, things started in a similar fashion for City, with Mark Hughes’ sacking coming immediately after the 4-3 home win over Sunderland with City sixth in the table. “A return of two wins in 11 Premier League games is clearly not in line with the targets that were agreed and set,” read the City statement and few can argue it was the right decision. Roberto Mancini was quickly appointed and De Jong remained a key player in the side under the Italian as City finished fifth in the table. The improvement in the team was obvious, with City looking far more professional and well-organised than under Hughes. They lost only four games that season and had a chance to qualify for the Champions League. However, Tottenham’s victory at The Etihad (or the City of Manchester Stadium was it was then called) courtesy of a Peter Crouch goal meant it was Spurs, not City, who landed a place in the biggest knock-out competition on the planet. City were improving all the time and De Jong was a vital component.

That summer, De Jong travelled with the Dutch national side to the World Cup in South Africa where he was a key member of the team which went all the way to the final. Playing with two holding midfielders, De Jong and Mark van Bommel, who were vital to Holland’s progress, they played a more defensive style than we had come to associate with the Dutch but results were good. In the final, which they lost 1-0 after extra time to Spain, De Jong was lucky not to be sent off after a terrible challenge on Xabi Alonso in which he planted his studs into the Real Madrid player’s chest. It was an incident which saw his reputation as a dirty player grow; an underserved reputation in the eyes of City fans who knew him as a fair but firm tackler. Upon arrival back in Manchester, De Jong was unrepentant about the challenge.

“I don’t regret anything. I never intended to hurt him. And after such a great World Cup I came back in the dressing room of Manchester City as a different player.

“I had just played in the final of the World Cup. It gives you a different status. The lads at City said they were impressed with the Dutch team’s performances out there in South Africa. That was really nice.’’

nigel sush

Nigel will silence the criticasters…


With De Jong’s status in world football on the rise, it was clear he was totally focused on the job of making City a force to be reckoned with. Going in to the 2010/2011 season, De Jong was feeling good.

“What makes it really hard for us, is that every team we play, sees us as the big favourite for the title. We are now a hot item in England only because our club have spent such a lot of money on new players. I am not saying they hate us in every stadium, but I do feel there is a tremendous amount of jealousy.

“I really think we must compete with Chelsea and Manchester United this season. Two years ago a new owner arrived here. Last year we laid the foundation, this year we have to fire from all cylinders. We must go and win trophies.

“We can’t expect it to be a smooth ride. United and Chelsea are established teams. Their players know exactly what it takes to win the league.’’

That summer, as Mancini set about building a team representative of his values, City had spent big, with David Silva, Jerome Boateng, Alexsander Kolarov, Mario Balotelli and James Milner all coming in. Yaya Toure also arrived for a fee of £24 million which saw talk of De Jong’s position being under threat begin to emanate.

“I see Yaya more as a central midfield player than a defensive midfield player. He has an attacking mind. I think together we can form a great partnership in midfield. It will be like a strong block. Besides, I have always been a regular player in the first team and I expect that will stay like that. Vincent Kompany and I are the only two players who have been with this club before the sheik arrived. So I think I am a player with a lot of experience at the club.’’

His place was safe. That season De Jong played 41 times for City and was one of the best performers in a side that qualified for the Champions League for the first time. It was also in May of that season that he finally tasted success in a blue shirt after playing a big role in the club’s FA Cup victory, their first trophy in 35 years. It was what De Jong had come to Manchester for – to help City win silverware and put them back on the footballing map. It was that first success that he claimed was the catalyst for what was to come.

“The FA Cup success gave us the taste for winning things. Manchester City hadn’t won anything with the group of players so, to win the FA Cup as a group last year, only made us hungry for more success because the enjoyment after no-one forgets. Every player in the squad wants that same feeling again. We just have to go for every prize.”

His final full season with the club saw the culmination of everything he had worked hard for during his time at The Etihad as City became champions of England for the first time since 1968. However, it was also the season that his role at City began to diminish as he played only 14 league games for the club, a statistic unthinkable during previous seasons, as Roberto Mancini looked for something different in order to push City to the next level. No one suffered more from Mancini’s switch to a more offensive style of play than De Jong.
Despite this shift in selection policy, he never once made inflammatory comments to forge a transfer. In fact, he often said all the right things.

“The team is the main thing now. Obviously everybody wants to play for themselves individually, but it’s not always going to happen, because we have a big squad. But for the team we just have to go now and try and win as many trophies as we can.”

However, Mancini had other ideas and he left City for AC Milan, a club with glorious tradition and a history of having great Dutch players. The signings of Rodwell and Javi Garcia offer an insight into Mancini thinking. Both are defensive players but both are arguably technically better with the ball. It seems De Jong’s limitations on the ball may have seen him fall victim of Mancini’s evolution. He was what Cantona termed ‘a water-carrier’; a non-flashy midfielder who would sit and break up play before giving the ball to players with more ability, something we may miss in the coming months and years.

His move to Milan is one he is relishing and he made his full debut in the recent 3-1 victory over Bologna.

“When I watched Milan in the 80s and the 90s, I dreamt of coming here to play for them. Finally I’m here at Milan and therefore I must thank Dutchmen like Van Basten, Gullit, Rijkaard and Seedorf. We have a young squad that needs to be built again, but I’m happy to be a part of this project. I want to contribute to the future success of Milan.”

No one can deny the history of AC Milan and It’s fitting that De Jong should get a move to such an esteemed club. Newspaper talk of a switch to QPR, where he would have been re-united with ex-City boss Mark Hughes, thankfully never materialised. De Jong deserves to wear the shirt of a great club – he is the ultimate professional – and every City fan wishes him well. He will always be remembered here in Manchester.

In Milan, De Jong didn’t get a lot of time to present himself. He copped a nasty injury and is still on a recovery trail. “I like what I’m seeing here in Milan. A lot. The Milan model resembles the Ajax model. Young players are offered a chance to show themselves.

A tore achilles ended his season early and slowly he is reclaiming his leadership role in midfield. De Jong has not seen a lot of new signings. “From what I hear, the club wants to secure CL football first. I’m sure they have a list of names, but the talents we have coming through are pretty good and I like this new model. AC Milan is in development now and if you want to offer the youth players a chance, you need to take time to do this.” De Jong was part of Man City which tried to buy success. His new club doesn’t work like that. “That is cool. There are more ways that lead to success. I think we are one of the favorites for the title and I am convinced we will do really well.” De Jong enjoyed playing PSV. “It will be quite a job to brush them off. They have done very well. It was an exciting game and very open. I thin PSV deserves credit for this. Their willingness to play their best was very positive. The game in Italy will be different though. We will simply do what we have to do and despite my sympathy for PSV, AC Milan will qualify.” Nigel de Jong was Karim Rekik’s mentor at Man City for years and the two forged a good friendship. Rekik calls Nigel “Uncle” and Nigel calls Rekik “Baby Tarzan”, for his physical development in Manchester City’s gym….

Here is a little clip of the Nigel de Jong of Ajax:

And this….

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  1. It annoys me when De Jong is accused of kicking Alonso.
    To ‘kick’ someone you MUST extend your leg.
    It is quite simple really. This is not an English lesson but it might as well be.
    You can review the footage of the De Jong ‘incident’ from any angle and at any speed.
    He sees the impact coming, he raises his knee to his chest and takes the impact with his foot.
    Intelligent really. The human leg is one of the most advanced shock absorbers known to science. Intelligent, and entirely instinctive.
    Unfortunately, it also appears clumsy and with studs facing towards the opposing player it can be easily misconstrued by mentally challenged arm chair commentators as an act of aggression.
    He allowed himself to become an easy target for people with very little to say – this was his only real error.
    As a footballer, his achievements are quite apparent.
    Without De Jong we would never have made the WC Final in the first place.
    Without De Jong, we will not reach the next WC Final.
    Make of that what you will.

    1. It may not have been an “act of aggression,” but it was over the line. Bert demanded hard, aggressive play from his son-in-law and Nigel, and this one just went a bit far.

      Don’t get me wrong: I love Nigel.

      But to the rest of the world this seemed to resonate with something unspoken with the Dutch team at that moment, perhaps because of Bert’s calculus that winning ugly is better than not winning.

      Maybe he was right. No one likes losing.

      But the umpire who yellow-carded Nigel that day (Howard Webb) said that, after reviewing it from every angle, it was a red-card offense:

      Besides, we just can’t deny how ugly it was on the World Cup stage, regardless of Nigel’s intentions.

      1. And Howard Webb is incorrect.

        And so are you.
        This was not ‘too far’
        This was clearly a moment of unmeditated stupidity. Ergo, it was unintentional – so I would like to hear how it could possibly have been ‘too far’, when there was no intention (or even evidence of movement) to do anything in the first place.

        The blame cannot be attributed to either side, but I would like to add that in typical Spanish style, Alonso certainly made the very most of it. I wouldn’t have expected any less from him and his team mates.

        Sadly though, I do agree with one point. We were playing an ‘ugly’ game. Effective, but ugly.
        It is this volte-face of our national identity that allowed these witless clowns the opportunity to paint us with their brushes of ignorance.

        Journos love a story. They are paid to write words.
        Commentators are paid to talk shit for hours.
        Of course they would take this incident and exploit it for their nefarious means. How much do you think Webb is paid to fill some columns in the sports section of the Daily Fail?

        Bad science.
        You are better than this.

        1. Most red cards are given for bad /unintentional/ fouls. They are typically not based on intention–but on the severity or egregiousness of the foul. So he could have easily been given a red–and in most other matches he probably would have gotten one. But the official made a good call not to–after all, it was the WC final.

          1. ‘Most red cards are given for bad /unintentional/ fouls. They are typically not based on intention’

            I must advise you to re-read the rules of the game.
            Intention is very much important.

          2. Perhaps “Boss” should find out who Howard Webb is. He’s no columnnist for the Daily Mail.


  2. Great player.The disiplined man who knows his duty,he may be nothing in attack but 100/100 in defense always.Always mancity matches he rated 6-7 range,nevr seen 5 fro him.WC.dutch conceded only one goal in feild feild when nijel was there…that too with sudden change of Ooiger for Joris against brazil……

    1. Nothing in attack? the video of Nigel at Ajax proves otherwise…. I think clubs use him as an enforcer cause his skills in defence is far stronger than his attacking skills but that still doesn’t mean he can’t attack.

      Love that pic of him fist pumping. That intensity look. He really brings that to the field.

      btw, Man shitty just lost to Cardiff! hooray!

  3. Thanks for the great article Jan.

    I also respect and admire Nigel.

    The one thing I do criticize him for is that he should attack more. As Jan said Nigel started as an attacking midfielder so he should use those abilities to attack more than he usually does.

    He sometimes seems a bit static just focusing on defending and that’s why I believe we’ve criticized him in this blog because with Oranje our players have to play creative football and Nigel can do it he just needs to remember it.

    1. I agree. Nigel has dried up. Van Gaal tried to trigger Nigel’s creative forward passing by selecting and deploying Clasie/De Guzman on his spot and we have to wait for the effect this has on Nigel.

      That having said, in our toughest games, Nigel stood his ground. Russia 2008, WC 2010, Germany 2012, he was a rock. His value increases the stronger our opponents are. Nigel’s best game for Milan so far was also against Juve.

      Big game player you have to cherish.

  4. I’m worried about Leroy Fer. He is a player I truly like but with his new team he might end up ruining his career.

    He has just played once with Norwich so I hope they get better and Fer shines and moves to a better team.

    1. @Miguel he is been fucked by less intelligent players..Wolf muscle,runfast and shoot at sight thats english football….both are fucked up in such a nonartistic team

      1. ‘build muscle,runfast and shoot at sight thats english football….’

        I’ve watched your comments for a while. Why must you reduce everything to terms which fit only your viewpoint, and then state these terms as facts??

        I mean this in a very positive way: it might be advisable for you to actually watch a football game once in a while.
        This is not an insult. It is merely an observation – nay, a polite request.

        Your ideas come across as amateur, which is sad because you have some decent theories in there amongst all the hate and bile and vitriol.

        Might I also suggest you provide evidence (or examples at the very least) of your claims?
        It would make your opinionated statements more palatable.
        Peace out.

        1. I have been watch norwich ever since Fer and Wolf joined there.didnt missed their matches for a secodn in EPl.and i do follow many games out there.if u take Manu,Swansea.most of th teams play doesnt play nice football.everything is about power,speed etc.which id ont like.with money they have purchased some good talents in Mancity,chelasea an Manu.but still these english players,and most of the players are overhyped.i dont think lampard is better than kuyt apart from his better ball control.u could see some intelligent players in english team like Gerard etc.but am talking about the second line besides the normal national team players of England.
          Both fer and ricky lacks competent teammates lift their game up.but the case with Deguzman in Swansea is different wher he has michu etc.PSV or ajax will beat any team of Epl except Manu,totenham,Chelsea and Mancity.(coz these clubs have money and with money they brought quality).You why england national team becopmes a joke in WC/EC???for years i mean ever since 1966WC??there is something behind it.i mean they got the basic wrong.

          1. According to a theory I heard recently, part of the reason England under-performs in summer competitions is that the EPL doesn’t have a winter break like other domestic leagues. By the time the summer competitions come around, they are burned out.

  5. Talking about DM’s:

    Yep. First games he was sub and now full doing the full 90’s. Ayoub has won the DM spot and has done excellent today. Wins balls and then also has the technique and passing ability to let the game flow for his team. Nice talent to keep an eye on.

    1. Yeah , He was very good in the u19 tournament. One of the best Oranje players.
      I remember when the coach subbed him against Portugal , the team got screwed.

    1. He did but it is hopeless, especially with Pardeux at the helm. Newcastle is almost the worst team a player like Anita could have gone to. The crisis after half the season last year made the club go spend on a freight train of French bouncers being able to handle themselves in the physical EPL. There is no vision to play real football and with that Anita’s main strength is not utilized.

      Anita is a great shape keeper, a great constant option to play to as he makes himself available all the time, has 3 lungs, has great speed, has great passing accuracy, pretty good handling speed and a good interception and dispossessing ability.

      There was a quote from Zidane a time ago when he still played at Madrid. Perez (president from the club that time, who now is president again) went on selling Makalele and bought Beckham from United and this troubled Zidane in a great way. He asked himself:

      Why put another layer of gold paint on the Bentley when you are losing the entire engine?

      That is Anita. In the right system, having 2 half midfielders doing their attacking and creative magic, Anita takes care that everything stays in check and keeps on running smooth so they and the attackers on top can keep doing what they like and are good at. Ajax had a stunning record with him in DM. He is a player with a particular skill set that rapidly increases in value if a team plays in a particular way.

      What a waist to see him at Newcastle.

      1. I also agree.

        Tiju, take a look at how DRB constructs his comments.
        He makes a statement, and then he backs it up.
        He doesn’t force his opinion, he offers it.

        It is why he is so well regarded here.

  6. Fifa ranking for month of september will have some breaking news, germany will loose second spot to argentina, belgium will climb up 4 positions and Netherlands will drop to 7th place

    Probable September 2013 rank – Team – Probable September 2013 points – +/- Ranking – +/- Points

    1 Spain 1536 0 52
    2 Argentina 1263 2 53
    3 Germany 1261 -1 4
    4 Colombia 1223 -1 4
    5 Italy 1199 1 57
    6 Belgium 1159 4 80
    7 Netherlands 1111 -2 -54
    8 Brazil 1067 1 -22
    9 Bosnia-Herzegovina 1049 4 54
    10 Portugal 1029 -3 -70

  7. If Robben plays RW almost all the time in club, then why would not LVG do the same, it’s a crime to alter playing positions of our best players, it’s like playing RVP out of his best position striker.
    Robben in WC10: RW; Robben in EC12: LW; maybe it was not coincidence. The only problem so far is we never have consistent left winger, babel-affelay-elia-john, they never make themselves available for NT, while we have better in the RW positions, narsingh/ lens.
    I think if sneijder get fit in time, he should play make shift LW/AM, like what he always do and did in the past WC10 and inter. That means we can play another AM/BTB Maher or Ginkel behind RVP while sneiider can still produce his killer pass occasionally from his favourite position.
    That also means we need one attacking minded LB (willems/ aanholt/ buttner) whoever progress faster his seasons and one conservative LB just in case if robben has to play LW (blind/ Pieters) whoever gives consistent result this seasons.

  8. What strategies did Rinus Michells had that make Oranje perform so much better than their opponents at their time.

    I guess that it have been studied a million times why he outperformed every opponent in term of dynamics, style and results, but i haven’t read in this blog anything regarding his approach or his followers, and how can be taken into today’s scenario.

    Everybody in this blog will give their heart for a 2014 WC victory, true to our total football philosophy. Just imagine wining in BRASIL, not like we play in 2010, but like we play in 74 and 88. Spectacular and awesome football.

    I think we already have enough players to bring it on home, so i really feel that whatever is lacking in strategy should be addressed by the stars survivors of that battles, likes the Cruyff, Gullit that knew Michells secrets and were able to implement them in the field.

    I think those stars will gladly help if their vision would be taken into real consideration.

    1. Agree that we have players but we need at least 15 to win it.which we dont have now.You cannt compete with Ozil,muller,CR7,Nani,Mereils,Hazard,Debruyne,Fellaini,oscar,naymer,dante,T silva,ineasta,Xavimartinz,isco,Reus,Gotze,De maria,Messi,Agureo with schaken,kuyt,huntlaar,elia afellay,Blind etc.Ornage needs to find other equally competent players for WC14.till then its a dream.
      LVg must concentrate on players with capabilty and potential.i mean players who can play together and who is ready to sacrifice persoanl needs for team success.
      —————-Vorm ———————
      might be the strongest and most balanced team we could have now.But we need good replacemnet for every we have that??that is big question.
      2 Runners with intellignce and power=Stroot and Van ginkel.these 2 are essential for balacing the team without compromising in intelligence.
      3 experinced players with grit and intellignce-Persie,Roben and Wesly,who can score even from half chance.
      1 pure experienced destroyer to support comparitivly in experinced back line -Nijel dejong
      4-4 young and speedy defenders who are pretty good in build up and have the muscle to compete any one.(BMI-Reikik-Bruma and Janmaat)
      1- GK vorm.clam and stable guy with spiders reflex,would be a penalty killer too.
      But when we look in to the bench we dont have much quality.this is what happend for U21 in Israel..

      1. I agree with most of that, but Vorm worries me.
        He ships goals at an alarming rate in the EPL. He absolutely cannot and must not be trusted with ball distribution.
        Did you see the game against Portugal?
        I think the statistic (without finding it back) was approaching 70% possession loss in the second half after Vorm touched the ball.
        That’s staggering. Shocking.
        It means that he spent almost the entire second half hoofing the ball up the field for Portugal to collect and return into our territory. That’s unacceptable for any team, but for Holland???? It disgusts me.
        And of equal concern is his complete inability to organise his defence. He’s like a field-mouse back there. He needs to be more vocal, more demanding.
        At the moment he wouldn’t say “boo” to a goose.

        His cat-like reflexes are the only thing keeping him anywhere near the national team.
        My animal analogies aside, the rest of what you wrote is pretty insightful.
        And yes, we Dutch will always ‘dream’.

        1. i did saw many times vorm colapse and conced more than 3 goals.thats clearly not a good present steke and krul are not in form.thats why i picked is back from injury and one is stablizing in new club.

          1. Yes, I’m not suggesting we have a better option at present.

            I am just VERY wary of building up these players so that we can so easily tear them down again when they do not perform to our over-imaginative standards.

            We must stop pretending to be world-beaters. We are not.
            We have a few good players (and a complete lunatic as coach). That’s it.

    2. Thanks for the topic. But it has been debated many many times in the past years.

      But I am happy to return to it and take one of the older posts and rehash it a bit.

  9. May be second 11.
    –Lenz/Urby—Seim Dejong—Wijnaldum——-
    Peiters———————Ricardo vanrhijn
    Afellay is injured till 2014.hard to belive that he will save us.
    Kuyt cannot compete with Gomez,Fred,Messi,CR7 as striker spot.still he is the 4th best behind RVP and Lenz and seim.
    Schaken ???Boetius??? not much hope ,one is too young.
    Vaart-Shadow of old Vaart.
    Maher-Thin and fading away towards end of game.lacks grit to compete for a WC.
    Lenz-If not playing regular needs to be dropped.
    OLa-Hope he becomes strong mentally.

    1. Tiju you have some football knowledge and I agree with 80 % of what you say, but I think you shouldn’t put daily lines up every time where your mind is always changing.

      It’s normal to change your opinion about a player, it’s the same for me, but on your 30 previous lines up, Maher was present, and now maybe you watched the game against Heracles and didn’t like him, so you put him off and chose for Duarte who makes his first apparition in your lines…If you do that for every game, it will be hard to follow.

      Wait some months before to make a right opinion about players and put a line up after.

      1. Still i like Maher,coz he is effcetive,i thought he will be our ineasta.but seems mentally was hard to drop him.i mean so hard.Against heralcles most of the guys got out muscled not only Maher,strong wijnaldum,depay etc.Some how i feel duarte would be better for national team than maher.its intusion and feeling..i hope Maher develops in to a great player.

        1. Why effective ? His “best” game against Italy where everyone started to talk about him was a game where he scored no goal and gave no assist…His statistics with AZ : 12 goals in 66 games, I don’t remember exactly about assists statistics, but it’s not more than 10/15 I think, as he only gave 4 last season…

          He is young ok, but he is so faaaaaar to be considered as effective especially for someone playing as high on the field, even Eriksen whom I don’t really like is 3x better talking about effectivness.

          1. Not effetive as scorer but as team player.his team plays well and there is chances for team mates to score goal.thats what i meant for effective ness.

  10. I say leave Robben on the right wing as well. His cross percentage isn’t great, and his right foot isn’t that good.
    Yes, he is a bit ‘one-note’ on the right wing, but its a damn good note that you can start with or bring on when the LB is getting tired.


  11. I am not sure, but last game of PSV vs Hercales I saw Jetro Willems jumping up really high behind his man to clear the ball away. I see that as a Rekik trademark and I wondered if that is something that has sparked Jetro to do the same? Maybe he has always done that and I am only now paying attention to. It just struck me.

  12. Today van persie should face van Ginkel. I really hope Ginkel gets enough playing time “30 minutes at least ” ,do something remarkable ” assist or a goal “. Unlikely he will play though 😐 .
    I expect persie to score , but Chelsea will win.

      1. It’s like deciding which testicle I would rather have removed.

        Both clubs are a stain on the modern game.
        It is a shame that both cannot lose.
        Ah well….

  13. @Steen

    I think Depay is a bit underrated at the moment. People tend to look at wingers for their attacking contributions, but defense and tracking back have their value as well. Kuyt build his career in Orange on it. Depay is for me an interesting player as he works hard to track back. That is an important trademark for a winger to let coaches trust you to play in big matches. Even an outlier like Robben under Jupp was forced to track back and put in a defensive shift. That is arguably the best right winger in the world not getting a pass to drop his defensive duties.

    The mistakes he made are typical young dog stuff. I mean dribbling yourself out of pressure after a turnover right in front of your own box is just hilarious (Heracles). That’s tuition money PSV pays to raise an own talent and sell for big money, making a big profit on him. The AC Milan mistake is a lost hustle where he tried to keep controlled possession for his team. I am alarmed by the fact few media pointed to Brenet who just let his man walk past him giving ball watching a new meaning and dimension.

    Depay does have problems.

    * I think he is a bit restless and wild in his actions. I sense a degree of Royston Drenthe imbalance in him. I mean that literally. How Depay sometimes falls and trips like an invisible ghost is pranking him and pushing him so he falls to the ground. His close control dribbling shows flaws. He takes to much time to get his shot off on goal. He is not that fast for a winger (no Elia/Robben speed). Needs to learn to beat the mechanism of letting yourself slip out of peek performance after a blunder. Ruud van Nistelrooy was a king in this aspect of the game and is also somebody who actually drops by at PSV training sessions every week or so. I remember games of Ruud missing a huge chance or an incidental penalty. Ruud would come back in games then and score 1 of not 2 goals after it. That’s a key component to be successful in football and life in general. maybe they can talk this issue over after a training session. Finally he needs to become more accurate with his passing overall. See too many inaccuracy’s at times.

    However Depay takes great corners (can somebody at PSV tell Maher that a corner should get passed the defender clearing them near the first pole?), good free kicks, brings energy and randomness to the game. He is a bit of a maverick from who you don’t know if he is going to explode in the opponents face. I like that. He is a tricky player I love to watch. He is leading PSV’s team in key passes per game in Eredivsie (3), so that sense there is coming danger from his presence can actually be partly quantified apart from the ability to score goals and assist. Yes he missed some great chances, but where was everybody last season when Wijnaldum mist one clear cut chance after the other. Depay was pretty lethal when he made minutes as a sub at the start of his career in the PSV senior team. Maybe that will come back. I prefer to see him at the right wing in the Dutch NT than Dirk Kuyt.


    1. Absolutely agree.
      But I do have a question to ask. It’s hypothetical, so no pressure:

      Do you think that we would have lost all 3 games at the last Euros with Dirk Kuyt starting those games?

      I have no embarrassment in stating that I believe we would have fared better with some backbone in an otherwise gutless team.

      1. 2 defeats were inevitable not only coz of kuyt,presence of static midfeidl with Dejong and bommel.i was the one who predicted 3 loss,but i expecetd a draw aganist denmark in my mind.Any other day we would have won against denmark with or with out kuyt…

        1. Problem with kuyt is u cannt get yellow/redcard for opponet and he doesnt create much and hence scoring would be less,it was purely down to wes and Roben.

          1. With all respect, Tiju, I wasn’t asking for your opinion.
            I was asking for DRB’s, in acknowledgement of his comment above.

            Your prediction was based on Kuyt playing, and thus was completely incorrect and remains entirely invalid.

            What are your thoughts, my friend?

    2. Depay will be the new Ronaldo, once he settles down all his innecesaries tricks and learn to be more effective, just like ronaldo. He has I think more vision, more less the same shots, maybe if he lets the gim a little he could be more fastest. Agreed that he sometimes ressembles Drenthe when he magically fall to the ground, lets hope Cocu can solve this, but without a question he is the most promissing winger we have right know.
      On a side note what do you think about Promes?? He seems good!!

  14. I’d like Robben to start as right winger but constantly witch wings with Lens or whoever starts in the other wing. This will make defenders crazy because once they think they have adapted to Robben’s game they’ll have to deal with a new winger all over again.

    1. exactly!!! Look at Ronaldo during the last game against Oranje, he played left, right and center…

      Totaal Voetball is all about switching places… I don’t know why Oranje has to be so static going forward.

    2. Yes, yes, yes, yes and yes.

      It must never be a question of playing left OR right.
      We are ORANJE.
      Total Football. Naranja Mecanica, Call it what you like.

      We play all over the pitch, because we can.

  15. “In Brazil, because of the level of individual quality, coaches give their players that freedom. They want their players to run at people. If you’ve got two men marking you, players here think they can beat them both no problem, and that’s what they’ll try and do. If you did that in the Netherlands they’d yell at you: “Two players? Pass the ball back, keep it moving.” It’s a different mindset. One isn’t necessarily better than the other, but I certainly feel closer to the Brazilian way” .

    Intersting seedorf article on FIFA.COM

  16. I really hope that our winger for euro 2016 will be Depay and Boettius, both track back, score goals, and are very talented in general. Anybody knows when Boettius will be back??

  17. Image we had win the 1998 WC semifinals in the penalties against Brazil. How many chances would we have against France at the final ? Would be beat that team at their home ?

    Both teams, almost same players, played in 2000 EK were Holland beat France. Same question for 1992 EK and 2000 EK

    Gus Hiddink is a brilliant coach, same with Rijkard and LVG, but my point is why KNVB and Cruyff can’t put their problems and egos behind and work it out.

    The man is proven winner. Barca is what it is, because of him. Everybody see that.
    My point is that he is alive, healthy and brilliant. How many more years and championships we will pass almost making it, trying almost the best, when we have the best. Why he had not been given the chance, like Bekenbauer had it and prove it.
    I hoppe LVG will be excellent in Brasil but then i hoppe that he will be our man for 2016 EK

  18. Well,looks like Van Ginkel is not even on the bench today. Someone here mentioned that we will see in these few games for Chelsea where his place is. I guess now we see..
    Based on them he wont get many minutes this season,at least not until winter.

  19. Chelsea for Van GInkel is like Juventus for Elia, they r to ostong so, they can beat teams without van ginkel like what juve did.

    anyone know where is Elia now?? pfff remember Hamburg days, and his days against japan denmark and … very bad thing happened we miss him too much

  20. Van Ginkel should be on loan, probably one of our biggest talent currently, we need him for the WC, if he doesn’t play with Chelsea Van Gaal won’t take him for sure.

    Lampard, Ramires, Essien, Mikel, Oscar, De Bruyne, Hazard, Schurrle, Willian, Mata…

  21. Pfff really sad Van Ginkel isn’t even on the bench. He really has to work his ass off in trainings and also consider a loan move. There’s a long way to go in the Premiership but I don’t like the way it’s going for him at the moment.

  22. I feel sorry for Van Ginkel and can only imagine what he’s going through right now. It’s not that easy for a 20 year old kid to resist the temptation of playing for a top club in the PL at such a tender age(at the expense of personal development).This guy was literally duped into believing that he would be a guaranteed starter at Chelsea. That’s why you should never trust managers like Mourinho, who prefer having a plethora of superstars in their ranks to bolster their chances of winning silverware.I mean, look at Chelsea!! They’re already stuffed beyond capacity in the middle of the park,yet they’re about to sign Willian.
    Are you kidding me?? :O
    IMHO, Van Ginkel deserves a starting berth after his stellar performances in the pre-season. Sigh!!

    1. @Abhirup majority of the star chelsea players doesnt have the intelligence of Vanginkel.Van ginkel is born runner and attacker,he is in a boring wrong team.Considering other hyped stars of chelsea,i still have a hope for vanginkel.once Jose understands the real Van ginkel.its done for other players.
      IN attack
      Oscar is joke compared to Vanginekl
      Hazard is joke compared to van ginekl
      Shurlle is joke compared to vanginekl
      Only mata has the quality.
      Ramires is a hard woker
      Lampard is old and not that comfort on ball as Marco.
      only thing needs that Jose should trust him and support him.Likecocu does for PSV guys Bruma,reikik etc

      1. Come on Tiju. Van Ginkel is an unproven raw talent. Oscar plays for the bloody Brazil team!! And has played for Chelsea one season. Hazard is a phenomenon. Shurrle played for Leverkusen in the Bundesliga. Stop saying silly things 🙂

  23. I don’t feel sorry for him at all. I blame his agent and especially his stupid club of Vitesse who decided not to sell him to the competition ie Ajax as if Vitesse had any chance of competing with Ajax. It is a total disgrace. Young Dutch players are not learning from their mistakes. His career may be ruined. He will never break the line-up. if he had any sense he would asked to be loaned back to Vitesse since he can’t go to Ajax.

    1. Jeff, I share same feeling. I can’t feel sorry for Ginkel as nobody forced him to go to Chelsea. These young and dumb kids seem to have no intelligence at all with regards to their career. I mean how can you not see who Mourinho is and how many stars are crowded in Chelsea’s midfield!!!! Either dumb or blind. For a few dollars more you jeopardize a brilliant future. Dumb.

      1. Yep me too. I predicted it and sadly it is coming true. His manager recently said: “Maybe it was wrong of Marco to go to Chelsea. Who knows. Clubs don’t always keep their word. They told us he would play often”.

        Yeah right!! Fukcing agents don’t give a shit. They bag the commission and move on. Chelsea is not the right club for any young player. Bruma, van Aanholt, Ake, now MVG. They buy for the sake of buying. Any club with Abramovic as owner and/or Mourinho as coach: AVOID

  24. Bad situation for Marco. I can Imagine how he feels now.
    I didn’t expect him to start , but not being even on the bench indicates that mourinho doesn’t trust him “till now” or he simply feels Marco won’t be helpful in this game.
    I hope he gets a loan move to another EPL team or a bundesliga team before the transfer market ends.

  25. Van Ginkel doesn’t need to be on a team that only plays anti-football. It does not advance his career. I hope he starts looking to the January transfer window and finds a way to join a team like BvB with a coach like Klopp, who fosters young talent. BvB players can get great opportunities because other teams keep raiding their top players, leaving gaps.

  26. @ Tiju
    Oscar is joke compared to Van Ginkle. With due respect, the statement itself is a joke. Confederation cup, EPL, UFEA Champions league Oscar has already proven himself at big stage and has cemented authority in generalling the midfield, both at Chelsea and Brazil

    Goal Platyer rating :Dropped very deep at times to instigate attacks as Mourinho showed how much faith he has in the No.11 to orchestrate the play. Had Chelsea’s two best first-half chances but both were dealt comfortably with by De Gea.

    The statement itself shows their relationship, just like Mou had with Sneidjer at Inter

    Accuracy,passing, defense, versatility, Van Ginkle matches Oscar in all this department, but I think when it comes to attack and scoring goals Oscar has got a upper hand at this stage, Van Ginkle has yet to make statement in this department and unless he more playing time he wont be able to prove himself in Moruinho Books

    with Mou I think his trust and Integrity , all comes down to match winners and Oscar has already proved himself there. As for Van Ginkle, long way to go and as it is, things are looking blink for the young lad.

    1. @wilson..winning some cups doesnt make a player more intelligent,it will give you experience.oscar got some experience. have seen individual play of Van ginkel and Oscar.Van ginkel is way to athletic,intelligent and better hard woker than Oscar.thats why i said compared to Mraco many chelsea players are joke.Van ginkel will do much better than oscar if he is given his position..mark my words..

      1. Agree but at this point in time it would be useless to say anything about him especially when you are comparing him with Hazard and Oscar. I think Mou will build him up by using him slowly in games with lower ranked sides in EPL and bring him up to the big stages. Obviously the time factor will be his enemy again going into WC 2014.

  27. For those who live in the US, how do you get the European leagues highlights?! I used to follow on Fox Sports at 10pm but they seem to have abandoned the show this year. I have no idea where else to check. Thanks.

  28. Chelsea is causing us more problems guys! There is a name u seem to have forgot about!! Nathan ake, this guy last year around the end of the season was playing regular, he started many games, and he was always on bench! If Benitez was still at chelsea ake by now would’ve been a regular!! Now, thanks to Mou who I already hate, nathan ake is a name we already forgot about and he is destroying an idiot called van ginkel who ran to chelsea instead of Ajax where he could’ve been a star this year!! These young Dutch players are not learning from previous cases, how many cases so far lik van ginkel? Tens of Dutch talents wasted thanks to the wrong choices!!

    1. @Alaa

      Marco van Ginkel wanted to move to Ajax. But, Vitesse made priority to sell to Chelsea. Otherwise, they just don’t want to sell players to their competitors.

      1. @Felix .if he really wanted to move to Ajax no one in vitsse cannt touch that(IMO).Vanginkel didnt had a solid decision.But looking at the inferior but hyped players of chelsea he will flurish better than nayone there if he is playing roaming midfeilder.the fuck of a problem is jose is defensive coach and he uses him as F$%^6king holding mid and that kills this guy.

  29. I think should be more proactive in signing van ginkel, they should offer to loan their young players to help out viteese to survive when they losing van ginkel. Viteese then would not see ajax as competitor which they are not, imo, because viteese mostlikely competing 3rd-5th places every season. This also good giving experience to ajax young players.

  30. ratings are ridiculous ,Valencia was very good was much better than rooney.Young was crap compared to Valencia.Rooney Who played crap in first half and 2 golden chance he got to assist RVP and he didnt want RVP to score.The poisn went for self glory,he got 4 rating.that really sucks. i just hope MATA COMES IN FOR rONNEY IN Manu.i would be happy if Mou sendd Ginkel on loan to Manu,the attacking team.

    1. ‘Valencia was very good was much better than rooney’

      Utter nonsense.
      I don’t know which game you were watching.
      Rooney was fighting to prove himself to two managers last night – and it clearly showed.

  31. Like most of you I’m really pissed that Van Ginkle did not get a start against MU. Having watch most of the match I feel that MVG would have been the perfect player to inject into the match along with Torres. Mou tried a different formation in the midfield according to the telecast, it did not work, all it created was a stifled game I guess it worked defensively as RVP got very little ball from the midfield, I can only remember 1 chance at the death. Mou could have given VGinkle a chance to show what he has got, I agree with Tiju that he is as good if not better than most of the Chelsea midfielders, except experience of course.
    I’m guessing that they played for a draw and made what should have been a footballing spectacle into a bore!
    I also watched Swansea V Tottenham , now Spurs have arguably the strongest midfield in the league, definitely the biggest, so De Guzman was always going to have a tough match, but I saw enough good first touches and short passes to think that he will develop well at Swansea. He is playing like a holding mid so he gets a lot of ball possession, that can only be a good thing for him ( time on the ball under pressure).
    I missed Ricky Wolf but will try to watch him next week!

    1. @Vanbanger…i belive Swansea doesnt deserve that loss to was a FLUKE VICtory for them.these portugses coachs are defensive coachs with less craetvity andf inovation.Swansea played well with the ccomeback of 2/3 players like deguzman etc..

  32. PSV is going to Milan with Narsingh, Bakkali, Wijnaldum and Toivonen. Only Hijlemark is missing.

    I’m not a big fan of Toivonen just like I’m not a big fan of Siem De Jong, especially when they’re playing at 9,5 position, but both can score important goals. And PSV needs to score tomorrow. I’d bench Depay and Maher for Bakkali and Toivonen.




    With Depay, Narsingh, Maher and Locadia on the bench.

  33. Some of you people are borderline retarded.
    Van Ginkel took a ‘slight knock in training’ and was rested for the match.
    You fans are like a bus of screaming schoolgirls plunging over a cliff. It’s hilarious. Really. Take a look at yourselves.

          1. BTW: Thanks for the humor. So funny that you think Howard Webb is a columnist for the Daily Mail. Ha! 😉

            (In reality, he’s the guy who officiated the 2010 World Cup Final.)

      1. Totally agree, Tiju.

        But he does have the talent to claim the position for himself – whichever position that might be.

        It is not time to get the rope and lynch ol’ Maureen just yet.

    1. Look Boss,can you just put your source of info instead of that nonsense name-calling statements. Many people did not know he took a knock in training,myself included.
      I would very much like to know where you red that instead reading those other unnecessary words. Thanks

  34. the Van Ginkel debate is fruitless…

    The kid is 20 years old, he has THE Frank Lampard in his position.. a Chelsea hero… To start him against Man Utd would have been a huge gamble by Mourinho. Fernando Torres stayed on the bench until later.

    It’s been only two games, MvG’s turn will come.. He will initially play fewer minutes and then will grow into his role..

  35. @Balkan, re Euro. Highlights in USA.

    If you get BeIn, it has football show. ESPN also has a show called ESPNFC which shows highlights. NBCSN which now has the Premiere League rights, has extensive highlights of the Premiere League on Sat. and Sunday evenings, and if you don’t mind watching in Spanish, ESPN Deportes shows a lot of highlights.

    …but yes, I miss the recently defunct FSC one hour news show. It covered everything.

    1. Thanks Andrew. Yes I have subscribed to BeIn which includes NBC and a bunch of fishing stations. But that FSC summary at 10PM was really nice. ESPN Deportes is not bad but those spanish commentators talk too much and mix soccer with baseball and formula 1 etc.

  36. Rob Jansen (agent) on Van Ginkel being loaned out: We hope not, because that goes against all agreements, but you never know. [nusport] #cfc
    Via Moahamed Moallim

    Well , sounds great for me !

      1. Sana is talented even if he didn’t really impress with Ajax. I think he should be given another chance , especially if Bojan keeps up his pathetic performance .
        He is just a Pathetic player who is paid very high .

        Anyone guys who can tell how talented Davy Klassen is ? Can he be a real deal ?

  37. Milan Squad

    Goalkeepers: Christian Abbiati, Marco Amelia, Ferdinando Coppola,

    Defenders: Ignazio Abate, Kevin Costant, Mattia De Sciglio, Phillipe Mexes, Matias Silvestre, Cristian Zaccardo, Cristian Zapata,

    Midfielders: Kevin-Prince Boateng, Bryan Cristante, Nigel De Jong, Urby Emanuelson, Riccardo Montolivo, Sulley Muntari, Antonio Nocerino, Andrea Poli,

    Forwards: Mario Balotelli, Stephan El Shaarawy, M’Baye Niang, Andrea Petagna, Robinho.

    1. PSV squad: Dolce, Tyton, Bertrams; Zanka, Rekik, Bruma, Maher, Toivonen, Scarso, Matavz, Wijnaldum, Locadia, Arias, Joseph Son, Willems, Narsingh, Bakkali, Van Ooijen, Depay, Brenet, Hendrix, Park.

  38. Robinho, Kevin-Prince Boateng and Mattia De Sciglio are back in the squad after injury woes which saw them miss the Rossoneri’s opening day Serie A defeat to Verona last Saturday.

  39. i’ll go with Laurent Formation






  40. And now for some good news: The match fixers (Zagreb) who deprived Ajax of CL group stages in 2011 have been eliminated from the Champions League by Austria Wien. Not shedding any tears for them.

  41. So Narsingh is back? 😀

    I have a good feeling about tomorrow. Wijnaldum is fine and will start, Bakkali and Narsingh will add more options.

    My prediction is:

    Milan 1-2 PSV

  42. Re Sana: The problem is that he’s really good on the left wing (imo) but pretty average on the right side. Fischer has the left wing locked up, and if Bojan gets dropped, Sana would have to play on the right side again. I wish FdB would drop Sigthorson and play Fischer in the middle and Sana on the left, but since Siggy was one of FdB’s purchases, he won’t drop him (see Janssen and Boerrigter for other examples of this). He likes to play with a big imposing CF rather than a real footballer up there.

    1. I agree with Sana being much better on the left wing than right one, though, I think he is just not good enough for high level. Don’t forget that Ajax brought him from nowhere, he wasn’t even known in Sweden before to come, though being already 23 years.

      Technically he is really interesting, got tricks and agility, but he lacks positionning, power, speed,shots…He played 5 games in CL last year but I never felt he would be able to score or something, he was quite invisible every time.

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