Steven Berghuis: European Top!

Trust me, I didn’t write this post after Ajax – Besiktas. I started this post a day before. But Berghuis’ goal and assist do carry weight of course, considering today’s topic.

This is also not to keep on hammering home a point. This article was in Voetbal International this weekend and it seems only fair to bring this to your attention. As I know this blog has a number of Berghuis fans and Berghuis haters.

Only a month ago, Davy Klaassen position as Ajax’ #10 seemed not open for debate. Mr 1-0, as he is called, seemed to cruise in that role and last season he got 12 goals and 2 assists for his club, as midfielder.

And yes, Kudus and Berghuis could also play the #10 role, but Klaassen wouldn’t be easy to replace.

Berghuis was signed as a right winger, as alternative for Antony. And friend and foe knew, that was going to be a hell of a competition for Berghuis.

In the 3rd Eredivisie match vs Vitesse, Berghuis was even benched and he saw the Brazilian mercurial winger explode, scoring 3 assists.

Ten Hag did use Berghuis in that match, but as sub for the #10 position. Ten Hag: “I said it before, we have to start the competition while we are still trying to gel the team together. We have several players for the #10 role but they’re all a bit different in their execution. I will keep on trying things out when we can, because we need to be as flexible as possible. This particular move worked well and I might try this more often. But it takes time for players to get used to each others moves and patterns. But good players always find a way to play together.”

After the international break, with Berghuis in a key role as a winger, Klaassen returned with a slight injury and the former Feyenoord captain was placed in the #10 role again. Against PEC Zwolle, he had two assists. In the Sporing Lisbon game he scored his first goal and created several chances. Against Cambuur he scored and assisted and versus Fortuna Sittard he scored as well while creating two goals against FC Groningen.

And thus, the discussion started: does Klaassen deserve a protected role? Ten Hag: “No one has a protected role in our team. Davy is a starter, yes, but we have many. We simply look at form and fitness. But we also check what the match needs and what the opponents’ strengths and weaknesses are.” Is Ten Hag able to keep all his players happy? “That is the job of a coach. You don’t control that, 100% but you have to manage it anyway. The team is always more important than the individual. Every player needs to realise this.”

The Berghuis stats are imposing. He was involved in 8 goals in the Eredivisie this season. The only one bettering him is team mate and captain Dusan Tadic, who was involved 9 times. Bryan Linssen (Feyenoord) and Seb Haller are third.  Berghuis created 16 chances for team mates. Tadic, Veerman (Heerenveen), Sinisterra (Feyenoord), Wittek (Vitesse) and Gakpo (PSV) are the only ones doing better than Berghuis.

But when we look at his previous seasons in the Eredivisie, Berghuis appears to be a guarantee for hoals. Since he came back from Watford in 2016, there was no player in Holland with more goals (72) than him. Linssen has 64 goals and Tadic has 57 since that time. The latter played less game though. There is also no player with more assists than Berghuis: 54 in 156 matches, followed by Ziyech and Tadic.

Lets look at Europe now. The big Five competitions and the Dutch Eredivisie. Since the 2016/17 season, Thomas Muller is the master assist king: 76 assists in 161 matches. Kevin de Bruyne is second with 68 assists in 155 games, and Messi has 64 in 174 games. Berghuis is fourth, with 54 in 156 matches. Fifth on the list is Papu Gomez (Atalanta and Sevilla) with 50 assists in 174 games.


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  1. Ajax is playing stunning football… i cannot see Manunited beating this Ajax team…Jurrien timber is excellent,so are all ajax players..Eric Ten haag is massiive,modern coach with Dutch pedigree and dutch style..i think barca and Spurs are aiming him….that would be huge loss for Ajax..You just give this Ajax team to FDB…he will tore apart this team…
    Thanks to Donyel Malen for his miss…Malen did a wonderful Job to remove that clown coach but great player..
    Eric ten haag and Arnie Slot…our Next generations hope…Can we add Henk fraser?? lets see..

  2. Nice article, Jan. I was wondering about the timing, though. lol

    I don’t know much about Besiktas other than their reputation as one of Istanbul’s big three, but in reading about them in the run up, it appears they were missing a number of players. But Ajax sure looked good; expecially in the first half when they ran rings around them.

    Re the individuals. Berghuis, a goal and an assist, and in the middle of things. Gravenberch, too, a strong, aggressibve game. Haller just scores. Tadic makes the team go, and Alvarez is solid in his role. Mazraoui looks like he did in the semi-final run a few years back.

    Dortmund will be a good measuring stick, but Ajax’s talent and depth makes me feel that its more than just wishful thinking that they could have a long run this year.

    1. @Andrew…Ajax plays technically superior game than EPL teams…yes EPL teams have stars but Ajax overcomes it with brilliance.. All EPl teams will struggle infront of this Ajax…You need help from refree to beat this ajax team…however i do understand they tend to concede unnecessary goals…may be thats part of game…

      1. @Tiju, I like your optimism. I’m optimistic but cautious Playing a subpar (by that I mean missing a number of players) Besiktas team is not like playing a top EPL team, where they will be challenged by speed and physicality. I’m looking forward to the Dortmund match, it will tell us something.

  3. Guys I have been watching him and as much as I want to jump on board with you guys , I do have some lingering doubts in regards to his comfort zone and whether he can step up out of when required. For this reason I will wait for bit longer and if he can prove either wise, that position can be his.

    This is what im picturing, Berghuis vs Kante, berghuis vs Jorginho, berghuis vs veratti, berghuis vs Philips, berghuis vs Busquets, Berghuis vs casemiro, Berghuis vs Sanchez.

    Just one question. Can he live up to expectation against them. This is where I feel its bit early and maybe one or two games with top guns could well settle the dust.til then.

  4. Re: Steven Berghuis: European top

    This new-found fascination to discover Cruyff in Steven Berghuis WILL fail. Maybe not against Latvia or even Turkey. But it WILL fail. Why?
    a) Berghuis is not half the player Cruyff was
    b)Berghuis won’t find himself surrounded by the technical ability that Cruyff enjoyed and which enhanced his game.
    C) It’s just another fairytale idea that attempts to harken back to the good ole days of dominance with little regard of the personnel at hand.
    d) The barometer for such wayward suggestion is mostly the Eredivisie. Cambuur, PEC Zwolle, Fortuna Sitters, FC Gronigen.
    e) Besiktas and Sporting are far from European powerhouses.

    The biggest mistake LVG can make now is abandoning the successful experiment of Klaessen in that role and go after another lightweight pipe dream.

    Oranje is not always going to be playing Lithuania and co. Oranje is going to be put on the back foot and are going to lose control against superior competition. Oranje will have to deal with the high tempo and physicality that comes with the adrenaline and technical pressure of the world’s best players giving their all knowing they might not have another four years in the tank.

    I don’t think Berghuis can handle the physicality nor tempo of the the biggest stage in the world. He was a great big flop in the EPL which I think is the closest thing to international football in terms of its rhythm and class.

    5-6 of this Ajax team have been flops in the EPL. Including klaessen. But we have seen in Klaessen(at least in the past three games) a stability and sense of reliability that haven’t been present in the NT for a while. He is big, rugged, defensively solid and made for the aforementioned tough road ahead. His technical ability is nothing to be ashamed of and he scores goals.

    Berghuis is a lightweight, sort of a luxury(which Oranje can’t afford btw) and will be swallowed up in the cacophony and swirling turmoil of a predatory Portuguese midfield or just the brute physical and technical presence of, shall we say France.

    I know the campaign for Berghuis is ramping up at the Zeist. LVG would at least be thinking about it. We await another inquisition. Of course predicated on LVG’s desire for another quest of the Holy Grail.

    1. @Orangutan. I think you may be overstating this a little. Has anyone actually compared Berghuis to Cruyff—or Gullit, or Bergkamp, or Robben or any of the other generational players of the past? I understand hyperbole to make a point, but…

      I think he is having a good turn and people are taking notice, and, as is typical, when someone does something new or that wasn’t seen coming (here, him shifting into the No. 10 at a time of need for Ajax), it gets commented on. My personal feeling is that when the dust gets settled, it will be him back on the wing and Klaassen in the middle. For the NT, based on the way that Klassen and Depay meshed in the last two games, I doubt you’ll see him breaking the combo up. For Ajax, its different. So much will depend on how Antony plays. His balls skills and physical gifts are superb, but last night I thought I saw warning signs; that he seemed a little more enamored with playing with flair than doing the basic job of putting the ball in the net. It may be, as you feel, that Berghuis will get swallowed up by the bigger competition. That will all sort itself out on the field. But at this point, given the internal competition at Ajax (Klaassen and Antony), and in the NT (again with Klaassen for the 10—if LVG is even considering playing Berghuis there, and Lang on the wing), its not going to be that Berghuis plays because there are no options.

      1. @ Andrew

        As you yourself have suggested, the comparison between Berghuis and Cruyff is a hyperbole, a deliberate exaggeration. But the use of such language usually comes with merit.

        Ajax have got the ball rolling with this Berghuis playmaking foray. The last thing that would surprise me is LVG continuing on on that path especially if Klaessen misses some club football as a result of Ajax’s decision.

        We have Gravenberch, Til and other personnel that I feel are a lot more physical on that slot and may prove more useful when push comes to shove.

        1. @Orangutan, Fair enough.

          I have alot of belief in Van Gaal, and I don’t think he will be swayed by any whispering campaign. This isn’t to say that he wouldn’t play Berghuis there, but that if does, it will be in his judgment, on merit.

          Btw, has LVG commented on Berghuis playing in the middle? Does anyone know?

          1. No, I think Van Gaal prefers a box to box player on 10, like Wijnaldum, Klaassen or Til. Berghuis is LVG’s right winger of choice (for now)

  5. Guys, any website to view full match replay of CL matches? Trying to catch the Ajax, Brugge and Liverpool and other Dutchies games.. My usual website no longer playing the full matches replay..

  6. I watched the second half of Villareal vs MU. Danjuma did not have a lot of actions because Villareal play defensive most of the time. On the counter attack, he outrun Dalot and had a clever flick for Alcacer to score.

  7. I thought ten Hags handling of this situation is indicative of his quality as a manager. Compare with Ole and Donny… blocks a move, “you’re still in our plans”, watch game after game of what ever the hell McFred is doing in midfield, and still can’t get on.

    I think the cameras captured his frustration today.

    1. He has every reason to be unhappy. The manager blocked the move but he does not have any plan to use him. Well, Ole might be gone soon though. I don’t know if VDB can survive there, it is a wrong move for him. He should seek a move in January.

  8. When I first heard of Danjuma, I was like he played in the EFL, why should we consider him. Then i learn that he scored 15 goals and had 7 assists so I watched his game and I change my mind. I think he should be considered.

    When Berghuis join Oranje last year under FDB, I watched the game and I was like what kind of winger that does not have any speed. But under Van Gaal, I saw that he played well, Van Gaal created the system that could use his skill. Same for Ajax, Ten Haag found that the number 10 role is more suitable for his skill and move him there and he did well since then. I changed my mind when I watch players playing in different games, maybe they developed to be a better player or maybe they are playing in a better tactic that suit them well. I hope people in this blog will be more open minded and judge players based on their performance now instead of year ago.

    Regarding Berghuis, he got a lot of hate here and i don’t get why. Except one game against Norway that he was really bad, he was decent in most of the games he played for us. His G+A return is a lot higher than some favorite names in this blog. Stengs and Boadu was brought up as savior to this team 2 years ago. Moreover, you need to know that he is playing as a 10 now. Klaassen is not starter anymore at Ajax, Wijnaldum does not start for PSG, the midfield selection is very limited as this moment and Berghuis is one of the midfielders that perform recently so why does he get so much hate?

    1. It is not like the coach bench Bergkamp or Robben for Berghuis. The reality is that we do not have a Bergkamp or a Robben at this time. I think you vent your frustration at the wrong guy. Your frustration is why the system do not produce Bergkamp or Robben anymore. Ajax seem to do better recently with young player development but PSV, Feyenoord and AZ need to step up also. This is not Berghuis’ fault that we do not have those players anymore. Or maybe you just look for a space goat to escape this reality.

      1. @ Kevin

        Klaessen is no Bergkamp or Robben. But the point is this. He has been stoutly involved in the NT playing some of the best football in the past 2-3 games than I’ve seen in years. Why would anyone even think of changing that? It’s like when kuyt was in the team. Not the most refined of players but he binds things together and brought about better cohesion and performance.

        I think a better question you might want to ask is this, “Is Berghuis a Bergkamp or Robben for LVG to even contemplate disturbing the dynamic and momentum presently in the team to accommodate him?”

        Nothing would surprise me though. They did it with de ligt v de Vrij. They tried it with Timber vs Dumfries(he was fit). Both failed. We still have to see how the unnecessary Biljow experiment will pan out.

    2. I have a decent job that pay well. What does it mean for credibility in this blog? Nothing. When I was in college, i spent entire weekend to watch league football and Tuesday + Wednesday to watch CL. Nowadays, I watch one/0 match per week because i am busy. I consider myself knowing less football now than before. This is my hobby anyway, i don’t need to be a coach to speak. I know FDB did a terrible job, I know KNVB was wrong in appointing him. Does it mean i will do better than him? No, because it is not my profession.

      1. may I ask you what do you think is the objective of the Blog. off course yes beggars cant be choosers and what we say here wont matter much but as fans this serves as good platform to analyze and debate, discuss issues in context to NT. i

        1. Yes, I think the blog is good platform for debate. And that is one of the points i am saying. I do not need to be a coach or a have a good job to discuss football. I appreciate your information, some of them are good such as who are making progress, some I don’t agree with, e.g. I think Berghuis are doing well and you doubt him too much, there is no alternative. But if I disagree with you, I can debate or I can ignore your post. I don’t agree with some arguments here from other posters that you can’t criticize coach or player because you did not coach/play before and i find the job argument is irrelevant. Hope you understand.

  9. Jan, you’re funny. This blog has been hammering Berghuis day in and day out for obvious reasons, yet you all of a sudden see him jumping a few levels and becoming some sort of a star. Ajax beating Besiktas is a given even if we play the C team (talking about Ajax of olden days), Besiktas is a 3rd or 4th tier club in Europe. I really hope Berghuis turns into a 1/10th of Bergkamp or Robben and it would be a success and worth an article to me. Right now he is a decent Eredivisie player worth not more than 5-10 million euros which basically isn’t that good. But here’s hoping he sets UCL on fire and delivers Ajax a quarter final.

    1. Well allow me to explain. I get my inspiration from what the Dutch media share on the NT. I am personally not in Holland so I don’t see all the news items. I wasn’t going to post anything on Berghuis and definitely not to make a point (see my first sentence of the post) but the VI had done the analysis and they said Berghuis was in the top 5 of European top players based on goals and assists. With De Bruyne and Messi. I thought that was fun to share with all the vinegar pissers here :-). I mean, we cheered for Weghorst, for Vince Janssen and for Karsdorp, so why not for Berghuis??

  10. I do not really understand this fuzz around Steven. He played for many years in AZ and nobody ever mentioned anything about him in this blog. His playing style has not changed since and suddenly he is a European Top?! I think Steven earned his popularity in this blog because of Jan’s and Wilson’s argument. Other than that, he is pretty ordinary player.

    1. Not true. I definitely mentioned him when he was at AZ and also when Adriaanse gave him his debut at Twente. When someone like Adriaanse spots talent (his strength), I pay attention.

  11. Watched the replay of Villarreal and Man United. Apart from Pau Torres in defense, Danjuma was their best player and also has become the focal point of their attack. Dalot will still be having nightmares after the game. Danjuma was just too hot to handle. If not for De Gea’s brilliant saves, Man United would have being humiliated. His runs were devasting and was very dangerous when in the box as well.

    In the end it was the super subs of united that changed the game around and they scored in the last minutes of extra time. Heart breaker but nothing to be taken away from Villarreal. emery has done a good job since taking over the team and probably with few more comptent players, they can shift another level.

    Fingers crossed both him and Lang will be selected.

  12. “why do they keep stumbling? because they dont have the right players and come selection they simply cant get it right. they think they can squeeze it it with respect certain players”

    I asked this in the previous post. Not vs Lativa and Gibraltar but come when it matters the most. They will. Bloody fools.

  13. I got a feeling that LVG is systemically phasing in and assessing new players. Also have closer look at LDJ vs Weghorst.
    In normal circumstances, you don’t need 4 GKs in the squad.
    I believe Danjuma isn’t far off from a call-up if he keeps up his play.

  14. This was the best window to call him up. Bergwijn was injured. Its a bloody shame and how the hell can you overlook someone who can give you goals to a pinch hitter. JC.

  15. @jan sorry i know its off the topic, but could you please share me your thoughts why Danjuma is not called up for the latest oranje team?

    If anyone who has watched him played against Manutd last night, it’s a big shame he’s left out.
    FYI Danjuma was man of the match in Manchester Utd vs Villareal game. What do you think Van Gaal is thinking? It’s utterly unfair for him , who had been playing so well , if not enough for the Championship but now paying in the La Liga and Champions league.

  16. There is only two conclusions you can make out of his omission. Firstly

    Who he is. If you don’t know or havnt noticed he follows Islamic regilion and the fact that he was born in nigeria,now the jury is trying to close one eye on him due to the pool of players now around in the wing department and it’s a clear indication they prefer and have already circled Gakpo over him who is still up and coming. So basically it’s a situation where they rate Gakpo highly to Danjuma, based on what ? Home grown?, PSV is a better club than Villarreal?. For the record and I have said this before, I have nothing against Gakpo but there is no way Gakpo is better than Danjuma atm. Atalanta,Real Madrid, Man United, exceptional to man of the match performances and still you get overlooked. There is no other likely explanation for this and over all why would you bloody need a pinch hitter Vs Lativa and Gibraltar.

    Even if you go back to koemen’s era when he called up him playing out of Club brugge. Back then he was called up based on pure merit and there was also promes, Babel and and bergwijn in the squad and yet he lived up to above expectations having only joined club brugge from eerste divisie.

    This is exactly why the Dutch football will continue to stumble while other teams will leap frog two fold Everytime.

  17. @wilson

    If that’s true then that’s really really sad.

    I’ve seen Gakpo and he is no where near or even close to what I have seen how Danjuma performed

    Bergwijn and malen is also not on the same level.

    In the first half against Man Utd , I could even see a bit of Robben in him and I can’t see that in any others of the other wingers we currently have . Perhaps Lang is also the exceptional one

    Danjuma I’d been following him since club Brugge and I’d say it’s a big big mistake and loss of not including him in the Oranje squad

    1. Yes, Danjuma not in the squad is a huge mistake by van Gaal. There is no justification. Our coaches keep making mistakes with the selection.

      Btw, this was my first post here for a couple of years. Been following the discussions though

  18. By the way , some good news to the Dutch teams
    Ajax , Psv , feyenoord , AZ Alkmaar all won the games in Europe . Does anyone know how we are currently staying in the coefficient ranking and how these four win has really benefited us lately ?

    1. We are doing pretty well! Need to continue getting points.

      I mostly use this wikipedia entry to track where we stand:

      It’s updated pretty quickly after the last game in each European games day.

      We are currently 7th with a healthy cushion over the 8th place (Austria). Coefficients are calculated by adding up points from the last 5 seasons. We are being hurt by the abysmal 2017-2018 season. Next season, when that season is erased, we have a good shot at catching France and Portugal. We are still behind by 1-2 points at this moment, but if we keep winning, I think Portugal is in our eyesight.

      The way each season’s points are calculated is each teams points are added up and then divided by the number of teams. A team gets a fixed number of points per win, draw and progressing in stages. There’s bonuses added based on progressing in a tougher competition (example: UCL vs. Europa League)

      Hoping for Ajax to continue winning in UCL and PSV to do a deep Europa run.


  19. It all about conscious . They should know better by now who can give what. Goal is the utmost important and everybody knows and has seen Danjuma is all about goals.

    Though his omission will have no impact on the two games but this was the best window to get up and have him in the running for the the last two important fixture. I dont think van gaal will opt to experiment in the Norway and Montenegro game given both are important games. And unless injuries I dont see him being called up at all.

    On a brighter note lets welcome Lang to the squad. Atleast there will be some upgrade in the team.

  20. Where is danjuma???
    How can van gaal did this to us.

    Danjuma memphis lang
    Frenkie klassen
    Malacia van dijk de virj Dumfries

    Van gaal u really didn’t this team??

  21. I bet Danjuma’s omission surely be asked in the press conference. Let’s see what LVG says. How beautiful the team would be with Danjuma in..

  22. Taking Lang is okay and good….i think berjwin is underrated,he gave Turkey a torrid time with his pace and trickery…that made Depay free….i think We mwill miss that in next game…Berjwin is hard worker…helps defense,frees Depay….Workrate of Berjwin is much higher than Danjuma and lang….
    why Luuk and weghorst???any one is enough…why De roon??????????????Time to find some one else for De roon…

  23. Omission of Danjuma is a bad mistake. But this is nothing compared to the recall of Luuk De Jong. I had high hope for Van Gaal as his start was very good but now I doubt it. As much as I do not want to believe what Wilson say, I highly doubt the ethic of the selection. I have been following Barca for a while, mostly because of FDJ and I can tell you that LDJ is absolutely sh*t right now. His return in 5 games is 1 goal. He missed a bunch of open goals, literally open goals. He is slow and does not hold up play. The reason he started for 5 games is because Barca right now is also sh*t tier club, they play 4-3-3 or 5-3-2 and they have exactly two healthy forwards. Here is his highlight in Barca jersey:

    1. I was talking about your jury theory where people in the circle will be preferred. As much as I want not to believe it, the LDJ inclusion made me think that is. There is no sporting reason for this inclusion actually. If missing open goals is criteria for selection then I can nominate myself to be picked also.

      1. Ok. You have interpreted it wrongly, perhaps my fault as well. The way I wrote it.

        Merit wise if you look at it and again from Jan stats from last post and his performance over the the last two weeks, then there is no doubt Danjuma is a front runner. There is nothing what Gakpo can do which Danjuma cant and while If you take it the other way around, Gakpo might fall out to certain qualities of danjuma.

        But Still gakpo gets that benefit of doubt from the jury which is a clear indication in which direction they want to go. This is where I meant they have already circled him for that position regardless of who, why or What.

        Once again I have nothing against Gakpo, but by no means he atm is better than danjuma. Just to make it clear.

        1. I don’t think I misunderstand you. I was referring to LDJ inclusion as the case to support your jury theory. He is not picked for sporting reason, he is picked because he is in the circle.

    2. @wilson: I saw you post a couple of Barca’s link about Koeman and LDJ here. I think it is misleading. Let me clarify as I was following Barca situation:

      1/ Koeman did not choose LDJ to replace Messi and Griezmann. He needed to let them go because of financial reason and LDJ is the cheapest option (on loan with 1m salary). Obviously, LDJ is out of his depth. Noone in Barca including Koeman think that LDJ will be able to save the sinking ship. What made me laugh is somehow for his brilliant work at Barca, LDJ is recalled to NT. Lol.
      2/ Koeman did not let Suarez leave. He was the messenger. No coach in the right mind will let Suarez, Rakitic and Vidal leave in exchange for Dest. Now Suarez will hate everyone, no doubt and he has the right to do so.
      3/ Koeman chose his job poorly. He is doomed the moment he picked Barca job. Did he do a poor job at Barca in term of tactic? No one will know, he was forced to let his best players leave year after year. Hell, they could not even sign a contract with Moriba, a young player that he want to play.
      4/ I am not defending Koeman or LDJ. I think LDJ should not be in NT and Koeman chose the job and so he suffered the consequence. But to understand the comment about LDJ is better than Neymar and Suarez link you post, there are some context around it and i just explain above.

      1. Im aware of the situation that unfolded around Barcelona in regards to the big salary cap but in that video its coming from the horse’s mouth that they should have been open to him. Didnt Pique take a huge paycut. Didnt messi also agree to take a pay cut. Was it by half.I mean they could have done this more sensibly. Look at how they cried when leaving the club man. Even if it was pressure from top, koeman as a coach should have understrod it better and be open about it. Well in is statement he makes it very clear how he was treated.

        I also read some where there are going for Cavani in jan. In other words LDJ experiment has failed and now koeman is deparately hanging on by the thread

  24. I don’t think I misunderstand you. I was referring to LDJ inclusion as the case to support your jury theory. He is not picked for sporting reason, he is picked because he is in the circle.

  25. Yan, thanks for your question on Danjuma. Allow me to try and answer it by trying to get into LVG’s head.

    LVG wants two options for every position. At least.

    And he wants them to play regularly and be in form.

    And he will not drop a player this month because some guy plays well in a couple of matches.

    Take De Roon for instance. He has been a valued part of the squad, if there is another player (lets say Schouten) who suddenly impresses for 4 games in a row, LVG would not drop De roon for Schouten.

    Dutch coaches don’t want to make the Dutch NT a “pigeon nest” as they call it.

    Bert van Marwijk was able to breeze through qualifications without any issue because of the core group of players he stuck to.

    Ok, so Lang versus Danjuma.

    Lang is considered a right wing option for Oranje. Danjuma is a left winger.

    Lang has been playing amazingly well for 1,5 season or so. Danjuma only recently became a starter.

    LVG has only one option for the right wing in Berghuis. Bergwijn is injured and El Ghazi is a left winger who is also not playing.

    So Lang is not a no brainer.

    Danjuma is knocking on the door, loudly, and LVG has confirmed this. But with Gakpo, Malen and Memphis as options for the left wing, he is NOT going to drop either one to give Danjuma chance.

    Plus, he doesn’t need to. Danjuma has played for the Oranje already. He is known in Zeist. He has a club suit already. Lang (and the goalie Flekken) are coming in so “Van Gaal can assess them”. This is also a personality assessment (that is typical Van Gaal. He won’t take arrogant bastards. Sneijder and Van Gaal clashed heaps of times and it’s not beneficial for the group).

    If Danjuma keeps his place in Villareal and keeps performing, he will definitely get a call up. But he will have to compete with Malen and Gakpo. I personally don’t see Malen as a left winger, but as a striker.

    For me, it should be:

    Left wing: Danjuma, Gakpo
    Strikers: Memphis, Malen, Weghorst
    Right wing: Berghuis, Lang

    Holding Mid: De Roon, Koopmeiners
    Right mid: Wijnaldum, Klaassen
    Left mid: Gravenberch, Frenkie

    Left back: Malacia, Blind
    Left CB: Van Dijk, Ake
    Right CB: De Vrij, De Ligt
    Right Back: Karsdorp, Dumfries

    Goalies: Bijlow, Krul, Flekken

    Extra “Covid” players: Timber, Bergwijn

    1. How is Gakpo ahead of Danjuma? Gakpo is still new to the NT. 2-3 caps. Malen I can understand he has been around for sometime now.

      LDJ’s spot is the controversial one and that should have gone to Danjuma.

    2. Thank you Jan!

      Your explanation is fair reasonably and making sense. I can sleep in peace now and let’s see how the Oranje squad will turn into from now till the next 6 months

      I like your selection and particularly hoping Kardorp can make it later too.

      Only pity to bergwijn and Van de beek , and I’m still hoping to see ihattaren but he got to prove him first . Tks Jan !

  26. Scout report

    Have being reading good things about Ian Maatsen at Coventry City who are currently third in championship but still a long way to go. Most number of successful tackles in the league. Scored is first goal vs Fulham

    His development has been going well. Last season in league 1, this season in championship with the fans raving about his performances. Dont think will break into chelsea any time soon but he will if he continues on this trajectory. He has that Ashley cole esque style.

    I was also looking at the Jong Orange squad, the fullback department is also flourishing with good depth and up and coming players, Ki Jana Hoever,Rensch and Frimpong on the right and bakker,Maatsen and Oosterwolde on the left. The future looks good.

  27. @ Jan

    Ready your post late above about my conclusion on Danjuma’s omission .

    “Bullshit Wilson. Utter fantasy. Shame on ”

    I actually had this in the post but removed it ,should anybody would bring it up for argument.

    Well I drew my conclusion from the Hakim Ziyech situation.yes you have discussed this many times here but the ” stupid decision by stupid boy” did come out of Van Basten’s mouth and it also did reflect their perception of thinking in context to mix dutch players. This was van basten and Van gaal is also no stranger to his egoistic menatlity which has led to many fallout with famous players.

    I really dont want to take this in the direction of racial contexf but we all know how system works in dutch football and and how hollow it is. again its a conclusion and not something im shouting overthe roof is definitive.

    LDJ a bench player at Sevilla who was never in the picture until his move to barcelona a club in crisis, plays just few games with no merit gets the nod. While on the other hand Danjuma who has been been overlooked to not being playing at competitive level (doesnt) even when he goes on to exceptionally prove himself at the highest level playing at Villarreal with same number of games and vs some of the best teams. This is where it gets controversial

    This makes you think, OK why,whats the logic here. Why a pinch hitter vs Lativa and Gibraltar, why him when Weghorst,Malen and Depay are all there. Danjuma should be a straight in replacement for injured Bergwijn while Lang on the right like you said. There has to be something but there aint. there is no legit jutification and it only points in the direction that LDJ is the right player for NT and not danjuma. Thats what you get from it and when there is clearly no merit to something then you have to move on and look at other aspects and this is where I concluded the home grown and his belief aspect.

    One thing here though, I used Gakpo more as a comparsion but again to say Gakpo is not droppable if you shift the attention away from LDJ, it can still be debatable. Gakpo is still new to NT and he still hasnt shown yet he is a player greater than Danjuma’s quality. You have to consider danjuma’s reign at Bournemouth and club brugge which he has carried it over to villarreal and proved critics wrong just in 7 games. He has also proved it at NT level.this is where Gakpo scumbs to be behind him. He is still a rookie.

    On a different context, look at the Buttner situation at Man United and how Van Gaal wrote him off before even arriving there and even in the NT without even calling up.

    You look at the current karsdorp situation. Rensch selection in the last callup. Timber now as a make shift back up RB. Its nothing new under van Gaal. I mean player preference.

    You come to the same conclusion. They draw the line for which player to come up or not and its not always the same for all the players.

    You call up danjuma now,in november or one week before the WC, he will be the same Danjuma. Like I said he has become the focal point of Villarreal attack and he will continue banging and assisting goals left right and centre through out the season. Like I said he has proved it in seven games and ig thats the case there should be any doubt.

    I doubt however he will be called up in November if Bergwijn is avaliable and with no other Injuries. And plus those are crucial and must win fixtures. Would van gaal opt to experiment in those fixtures. I mean inject new faces.

    Well lets see how it goes.

    1. I also find you Schouten example bogus. Its a club thing that Schouten has not been called up.. If it was for an Ajax player or if Gravenberch would have right sided MF, De Roon would have all long be gone.

      On another note De Roon is playing at a competitive level with respect to other players in that position and thats why he is still there. He can be useful in 3-5-2 or destroyer role if needed.

  28. Van Gaal

    Looking at his spiteful selection, one can only arrive at one conclusion: all Dutch coaches are cut from the same cloth. And that’s why they’ve kept it in-house. Anyone who attempts to break that mob/echo chamber mentality would be identified as a threat; an unrefined outsider who doesn’t have a grasp of football as it should be played. And it’s not going to matter if that individual has champion league and world cup trophies to back up his sophistication. It’s kind of a mass psychosis and a blood-letting of confirmation bias that has blurred reality to the point where it is whatever they say it is.

  29. @ Jan

    Re:And Orangutan’s choice as replacement for Berghuis in Oranje on the right wing is…….?????

    Any choice of Berghwin, Danjuma, Lang or any other winger in that class of talent should prove a lot more effective than Berghuis.

    I’ve said this before and will reiterate. The Dutch variation of the 4-3-3 is at its best, most devastating, with quick, strong, tricky wingers who won’t shy away from getting their boots dirty When push comes to shove.

    Think of the great teams in the past 20 years. Zenden. Overmars. Robben. Kuyt(hybrid player). With the exception of Robben, who is exceptional, all these players could put in a defensive shift when the going gets tough. Berghuis can never. Too languid. Fragile. And he is unfortunately not Robben. What kind of winger doesn’t have any pace to beat a defender on the outside and whip in something? A player that’s been accomadated, that’s who.

    They will tell you about the cutting inside ala Robben and their love for left-footed artists. Well, all the competition I’ve named for Berghuis are capable of doing that. And also have the pace to go on the outside.

    I have seen way better NT than this one. Teams like the 2000 one that didn’t have to work that hard because they were that good. Let’s not make any mistake about this team. These group of players(like the 2014 team) have to do the extra work to match up. And I just don’t think Berghuis is up for the physical side of it.

    1. have to say this was very evident in the Utrecht game, was dispossessed on several occasion. the only thing that made him visibly was standing over the corner kicks.

  30. Caught the second half of Ajax vs Utrecht. Please if you have chance watch this game.

    Maarten Paes played like he was playing a world cup final.

    Utecht 1-0 Ajax. Ajax caught out coldb on counter.

    1. I think you underestimate Luuk De Jong’s skill. Weghorst need to score 20 goals to get called to NT and Luuk scored 1 goal in 5 games and get called. By this rate, if he score another goal in this season, Danjuma need to score 40 goals to bypass him, I doubt that Danjuma can score 40 goals a season. Luuk just has a skill that fans like us can not see. Only experts can see it. Babel, Veltman and Promes all had those skill.

    1. Its not bad in context to the upcoming two fixtures. Luuk can go on to score and justify his selection which is typical and it could be on the cards but in long run it wont yield anything and is a waste of time because we have all seen what he can and cant do in more competitive games.

      with the WC at the back of the mind ,the objective should be to try and stay in touch with the top guns and the only way to do this is to get the best players up and running. not bloody LDJ. even with Karsdorp, why he is been overlooked still remains a mystery. it just doesn’t makes sense. you have good attacking fullback playing at a competitive level but still you wanna go with a make shift RB who is not playing in that position but has played there before.

  31. Van Gaal on not selecting Danjuma:

    “Speaking at his press conference on Monday, Van Gaal said on Danjuma, “He has changed clubs. He did that quite late and he didn’t play in the first phase either. He generally fell in. He’s been doing great in the last four games and can be there, but I haven’t decided on that. I don’t need you for that, to see that he’s doing well.”

    Van Gaal continued, “Do you think the KNVB has no scouts. I have to tell you honestly that we cleaned up the list two weeks ago. It contained 100 players and that seems a bit too much to me. But indeed, Danjuma is there.”

    The Oranje boss expects Danjuma to be in his squad next time if he continues this level, “We are watching everything and I am really happy that he is doing so well. Two goals again and decisive at the highest level. I can’t imagine he won’t be there next time. He can also go into a dip, that’s also possible.””

  32. Also, doesn’t appear that he will be considering Berhuis at No. 10:

    “In contrast to Ajax, Berghuis seems to have to adapt to a role as right winger in Orange again. ‘If I want to play 1-4-3-3, I have to have a right striker. I don’t have that if I put Berghuis at 10.'”

  33. Van Gaal on Danjuma

    Excuses excuses excuses!!! Excuses on top of excuses. There is something about excuses. People usually make them when they are clearly in the wrong and, well, have to make excuses. Van Gaal is such a person in regards to Danjuma. But this ain’t nothing new.

    Dumfries(and for the umpteenth time he was fit) was dropped for Timber(Ajax cartel) after being our best player in the Euros. He joined Inter almost 3 weeks before the Norway game. But of course the ready-made lack of fitness and changing clubs excuse was visited. I will wager my last penny that the ONLY reason Dumfries got back in that team was because of Timber’s lackluster performance against Norway.

    Fast forward to arguably the hottest forward in Europe for the past month or so, Danjuma. And of course the convenient excuse of changing clubs and fitness somehow came up again. Even though he has been playing full 90s and showing up and showing out.

    This kind of bias and divisive stance is both pathetic and shameful. Wilson talked about Danjuma’s religion and how that might have to play a part in these decisions. And as much as I hate been cynical, it wouldn’t truly surprise me. Why? Because patterns do not lie. With Oranje, petty vendettas, vindictiveness and lowly malice has characterized the running of this team.

    Truly exhausting.

    1. indeed pathetic excuses. how can you overlook a player who is in red hot form and probably the best Dutch player right now.

      This was the same story with Dumfries when he initially left him out sighting his late transfer to inter.

      “and I don’t think he has been involved enough to be able to aspire to the national team. He trained individually, doing only a week of group training. But since my doctors say that he will return to fitness naturally and that he will do well anyway, I selected him”.

      Rensch (bench players) over Karsdorp who was most active dutch player in the preseason and then playing almost every single game for Roma coming to the international break

      this is exactly what I said earlier about how they draw the line and its different for different players.

      at the end of the day we will just be bystanders and and have to succumb to the fact beggars cant be choosers. like what orangutan said “whatever they say, it is”

  34. Guys you crack me up! It is truly like we’re sitting in the stands being half drunk and emotional and spouting out emo fueled stuff that just pops up in our minds…

    Van Gaal perfectly explained why Danjuma isn’t in the squad. I also would have loved to see him, I am a fan of his ever since his NEC days. But LvG has good reason to work how he works. The prep for these matches started weeks ago and LvG felt it too early to include Danjuma. It’s not like we can’t beat Gibraltar without him! His time will come.

    The inclusion of LdJ and the comparison to Malen et al. LdJ is a pinch hitter. The best header we have. You always want someone like him in your 26 player squad. Goodness me. Malen and Luuk de Jong are totally different players. DO we forget he brought the Europa League to Sevilla? Did we forget his crucial goals for Oranje under Koeman? Treat the boy with some respect please.

    LvG will have some stern words with Noa Lang, who misbehaved a bit (a bit!) against Anderlecht, taunting supporters, battling with opponents and trying to play like a circus act.

    “Noa should not do this under my management and I will tell him this. Will I go to him? Oh no, I bet you he will come to me!”

    1. who compared LDJ to malen. it was weghorst, Malen and Memphis, three strikers and then whats the logic behind calling up LDJ when he never looked at in the last call up. he jumps from Sevilla to Bacrelona ,and all of a sudden he becomes good enough to get a call up, when he has been shitting all around.

      Danjuma should have been a straight forward replacement for injured Bergwijn, why fork out for an extra striker. I dont understand why they underestimate weghorst. as if he cant score with his head.

      I agree it wont matter much and I did say this, imagine if Danjuma gets injured some around the next qualifiers. they wont look at him come pre World cup and excuses will be other players have been around better than him playing together. this window would have paved his way for future appearances. FDB did the same thing in the WC qualifies before the euros.

  35. @ Orangutan…your comment: “This kind of bias and divisive stance is both pathetic and shameful. Wilson talked about Danjuma’s religion and how that might have to play a part in these decisions. And as much as I hate been cynical, it wouldn’t truly surprise me. Why? Because patterns do not lie. With Oranje, petty vendettas, vindictiveness and lowly malice has characterized the running of this team.”

    Asserting national origin or religious bias is a very serious charge to a person’s character, no?

    You reference patterns. Is there a pattern from LVG’s 2014 WC team that indicates that confirms that LVG engaged in vendettas. vindictiveness, malice, some bias related to a person’s religions or ethnicity? Is there anything in his past selections as a manager that he show he exhibited bias against Nigerian players, or players who are of the Islamic faith? (Kanu and Finidi George were important parts of Van Gaal’s 1994-1995 team.) Even if I were to accept the assertion that it is a characteristic of former Dutch NT coaches to act as you describe (and I don’t), I don’t see how characteristics of former NT coaches can be attributed to Van Gaal.

    It is almost as if you don’t want to take yes for an answer. Van Gaal said he is looking at Danjuma and he’ll be selected if he keeps up form. What is foremost on his mind right now is qualifying, everything is subordinate to that. Putting a team together is never an easy mix for a NT manager. Van Gaal has a team that gelled and performed very well in its last two games. Why would he change it by bringing in two new wingers? Once (if) they qualify in November, he’ll have a year to build his team for the WC, plenty of opportunity to evaluate players off of a full season, in matches, and in the longer training camp that teams have for the WC. If Danjuma and Lang play as they have, they’ll be in that team and competing for starting spots.

      1. why LDJ, when he is not warranted. this is more of a talking point. please don’t exaggerate on my Danjuma being a muslim comment. it was a conclusion . I have made it very clear.

        In generally, the idea of danjuma to come up and compete against Gapko and Malen and above all vs Lativa and Gibraltar is deceiving and fraudulent. he can clean sweep them in any game. again go and watch his game vs Belguim, yes it was just one game and it was also a friendly but that doesn’t change the fact that he has already raised the bar in NT. he is not a rookie.

  36. Is Gakpo the best winger right now. how many competitive games has gakpo played for NT to make him un droppable.

    @ andrew

    “Putting a team together is never an easy mix for a NT manager”

    they make it hard for themselves. look at other coaches.

  37. @ Jan

    Re: Van Gaal perfectly explained why Danjuma is not in the squad.

    No he did not. He made excuses. And you in turn doubled down and made more excuses. Excuses that LVG didn’t even make for himself.

    LVG’s excuse points towards match fitness. “He has changed clubs. He did that quite late and he didn’t play in the first phase either” Again, LVG was talking about the “burden and rigors” of moving clubs and how this somehow has affected Danjuma to the point where he doesn’t think he would be ready for NT duties. A sorry excuse indeed, given the fact that Danjuma has been playing full games and dominating.

    You took the burden of excuses to another level. “LVG has good reason to work how he works. The prep for these matches started weeks ago and LVG FELT it too early to include Danjuma”. If you’ve noticed, the keyword in YOUR statement(certainly not LVG’s) is FELT. You are wildly speculating, reaching, attempting to read his mind. Making excuses. How I know? Your logic of the “importance of continuation” flew past Lang and Flekken, complete rookies in the NT by the way. And you continued with your labored excuses. “It’s not like we can’t beat Gibraltar without him” As if that should ever be a reason for a coach not to have his best and most in-form players at hand.

    Re: “Noa should not do this in my management and I will tell him this”

    It’s well and good that the Iron Tulip is ready to put a young player in his place for acting out. It is fine that I see you stand for a disciplined team and arbitrary actions by an authoritarian coach. What I don’t understand(and I never will) with some fans is the inability to be outraged about things that are obviously going wrong with their teams. The unwillingness to see that sometimes the emperor has got no clothes on. I mean to the point of making excuses. I will never understand that.

    1. I can’t imagine being outraged over this omission, seems very dramatic.

      I think Danjuma is a good player, I’m honestly surprised, happily, that he has been able to perform at this level in La Liga. He’s performed at an extremely high level for 6 games. By November he’ll hopefully have done the same for a few months and his selection will be guaranteed.

      I assume the front 3 is going to be Lang, Depay and Berghuis so I’m not bothered about him not getting picked.

      If he’s top class, he’ll play for the team, if he’s amongst the crowd then it will be up for contention. Easy peasy.

      1. Danjuma was talent from day one ..koeman called him and he scored vs Belgium and we drew belgium then no 1 ranked team…His injuries kept him aside…But he was playing of late at championship level and was massive…i think some one close to Roben….Danjuma is much more potent than lang INFACT…
        However i am impressed with berjwin ,his speed,work rate and trickery makes Depay and other free…We are of winning team with Berjwin…He plays for Totenham and he even got chances in Mourihno eleven who often dumps dutch players…..i worried and sad about Berjwin…i hope lang stays in bench and gets 30 minutes as sub later on…why De roon???why luuk and weghorst together????i know luuk has scored some vital gaols for NT at right times….

        1. @ Derekvdberg91

          Ok, So what you are saying leads to this question, if Bergwijn is back in November whom do you see being dropped. Gakpo, Lang, Berghuis.

          1. because somebody will have to make way for him, because danjuma form anit gonna dip come November unless a major injury.

  38. @ Andrew

    Re: Asserting national origin or religious bias is a very serious charge to a person’s character, no?

    Andrew I see you have a habit of discerning things in a way you want to see them.

    Not once in my comment did I mention anything about the national origin of Danjuma. Wilson did.

    Never in my comment did I accuse LVG of religious or national origin bias against Danjuma. My stance was that I won’t be surprised if that somehow proved to be true.

    Re: Even if I were to accept the assertion that it is a characteristic of former Dutch NT coaches to act as you describe (and I don’t), I don’t see how characteristics of former NT coaches can be attributed to Van Gaal.

    Van Gaal has enough of his own favoritism accusation to need any from other NT coaches. He brought over half the Ajax team to Barcelona in his second coaching stint. Granted that bias might be borne out of necessity of what he knows and what has worked for him.

    Rensch over Karsdorp is a travesty. Trying to sneak in Timber to a starting RB spot is also a disgrace. Leaving Danjuma out is also inexcusable.

    Re: It is almost as if you don’t want to take yes for an answer. Van Gaal said he is looking at Danjuma and he’ll be selected if he keeps up form.

    I have no respect for Van Gaal’s promises towards Danjuma. He has proven to be bias and his excuses embarrassingly flimsy.

    Re: What is foremost on his mind right now is qualifying, everything is subordinate to that.

    😂😂This one is a true gem. As if calling up Danjuma and worrying about qualification are mutually exclusive. I’m not sure you thought this one through my guy because it does sound like a see-through excuse.

    Having the hottest European prospect amongst your rank might just help with Latvia and Gibraltar that you worry so much about Louis😁

  39. the Ajax contingent being called up is merely for marketing purpose and it goes in hand and hand with how the system works in the dutch football and the ajax connection both No 1 and no 2 have with respect to their past. its an on going strategy that works in the favor of both the KNVB and Ajax. if timber would have being a backup for De Light or De Vrij or if either injured would have been injured, it would have been legit, but they want to keep timber in the team regardless and again the CONCLUSION you get is the same and why karsdorp is being overlooked.

    even if you look at Gravenberch, since Berghuis moved to 10 at Ajax, he has being on a low profile but they still remain front runners.

  40. @Orangutan,

    “Not once in my comment did I mention anything about the national origin of Danjuma. Wilson did.

    Never in my comment did I accuse LVG of religious or national origin bias against Danjuma. My stance was that I won’t be surprised if that somehow proved to be true.”

    I don’t see the same breadth of distinction that you do. Were we in contact via a different means of communication, I would explain my position, and I think we would probably have a good discussion about it. But I take you at your word, and you have my apologies.

    As far as the other things. These are just differing views and opinions. Not “irrefutable facts.” 😉

  41. Com on guys, serious talks, whom do you see dropping out if Danjuma is called up and everyone else is avaliable including bergwijn in November. Lets centre the talk around this.

    Like I said there is no way there will be a dip in danjuma’s form unless a major injury. it will really be a shame though if this happens.

  42. @

    Nothing to apologise about bro, we cool.

    @Wilson Danjuma

    Why should any of them drop out? We have four goalies called up plus the immobile LDJ. Drop a goalie and LDJ and we’ve freed up two spots. Taking both Weghorst and LDJ would be a mistake but I won’t be surprised if LVG does.

    1. If Bergwijn is back then it will be him, Gakpo and Danjuma on the left. Sombody will be a surplus here.

      Memphis, Weghorst and Malen in centre

      Lang and Berghuis on the right.

      26 players due to covid, you could drop one keeper to accomdate for Danjuma, who else could force their way in. Wijnaldum’s situation at PSG has aready become a talking point. Can Van Ginkel make a come back, maybe not in November but later on. What about Veerman if he forces a move in Jan.

  43. If there are no injuries , I guess it had to be Luuk or Berghuis

    Thought I doubt Van gaal will drop Berghuis given the fact he has played “ so well “ with the team already.

    Gakpo in my opinion is good but not at the same level or proving himself being better than Lang or Danjuma

    Van Gaal already said it or would be crazy if he won’t see Danjuma in nov and I will mark his words

    So then we got 4 goalies right , than will make one place out for a striker

    Perhaps in the end he will give up one midfielder . We will see

  44. For the NT…LVG is more important than Danjuma or Lang for me….otherwise a clown like FDB will get you out of WC and EC…LVG is little mad….i think when he go for tournament he will cut 1 GK and either Luuk or Weghorst will be dropped..
    I dont rate Lang better than Berjwin…however Now lang got a chance and he has to prove…Berjwin was excellnt in last two NT games Vs Montengro and Turkey…i doubt that Lang would beat him…We should be happy that LVG is the coach Lang will have his chance and next month Danjuma also…Fart van marjwik would never give a chance to new player unless he is forced to…
    We should be happy to have
    Berjwin,Malen,Depay,Gakpo,Lang,Danjuma,Berghuis…..hope everyone stays fit and we take all of them..

    1. That’s all part of the excuse. As if Danjuma is not showing anything special. As if he is just another obscure distant prospect amongst a throng of players. Meanwhile, buddy has been running stuff for the past month or so in Europe.

  45. This idea that only Berghuis and Lang are capable of right wing role has to be aborted. We all know how our team loves makeshift duties when it’s players they approve of.

    Berghuis is makeshift. Lang plays on the left with Brugge more than he does on the right. I’ve seen Berghwin have a great game for Spurs on the right. Danjuma, Malen etc all can play on the right with a little adjustment.

    The real problem is silly decisions by management. Four goalies, LDJ and even to some extent de Roon(debatable but man really can’t play) have to be culled. Growth comes with discomfort and bravery. The NT haven’t shown any in years.

  46. @Derek

    Re:I can’t imagine being outraged over this omission, seems very dramatic.

    There is no drama involved here. Danjuma’s exclusion is a disgrace and underlines the kind of attitude and wilful ineptitude that has reduced a great footballing nation into the abyss of hot or not column.

    The real drama is watching LVG try to wriggle his way out of a senseless, spiteful decision.

    1. You think the reason we’re not challenging for World Cups and Euro Cups is because of player selection? Like in 2018 we had 23 players better than the France squad but left them all at home?

      1. @Derekvdberg91

        Re: You think the reason we’re not challenging for World Cups and Euro Cups is because of player selection? Like in 2018 we had 23 players better than the France squad but left them all at home?

        Your questions suggest an attempt at oversimplifying the reasons behind the NT perennial underachieving ways.

        Bad and biased personnel selection is just a symptom of a deeper and more endemic structural rot in the NT. Kind of a crazed spill-over wherein people in power make absolutely ridiculous decisions dictated by ego, vendettas and mob mentality.

        The appointment of Blind over Koeman serves as an example of that. You follow that with the appointment of FDB(against all reason) and you’re forced to see the systemic failure of an organization that is not steered by reason but an insidious underbelly. I mean, what other country(including Faroe Islands) would hire a coach that has been fired from club football three times on the spin?

        1. I think you’re conspiracy-theorizing this.

          Part of Holland’s decline is part in due to just the relative size of the country. Sports have become a factory system, and the way you find gems now is to pump out as many players as possible and hope one of them is great. There are more footballers in the larger countries so of course (on average) they’ll develop more top top pros.

          There’s also the decline of the Eredivisie, which is a financial issue. No Dutch clubs have major outside investors, nor do we have a billion dollar TV contract, so the Eredivisie teams are always going to be weaker, which again means that the means of development in slower.

          To think that our country went from perennial challenger to team on the outside because of a coach selection and player selection is absolutely absurd. You think that if we hadn’t selected FDB as coach then suddenly our team would have a Bergkamp, van Basten, Robben and Cruijff on it?

  47. Between Orangutan and Wilson, this blog has become number one for non sense and fake news regarding the Dutch national team. Oh well, have fun and continue to ruin this blog that was so much fun in the past.
    I will make one last point for my dear friend Wilson. As I was scrolling down, the word Ajax caught my eye so I read the post below from you Wilson: “the Ajax contingent being called up is merely for marketing purpose and it goes in hand and hand with how the system works in the dutch football and the ajax connection both No 1 and no 2 have with respect to their past. its an on going strategy that works in the favor of both the KNVB and Ajax. if timber would have being a backup for De Light or De Vrij or if either injured would have been injured, it would have been legit, but they want to keep timber in the team regardless and again the CONCLUSION you get is the same and why karsdorp is being overlooked.
    even if you look at Gravenberch, since Berghuis moved to 10 at Ajax, he has being on a low profile but they still remain front runners.”
    I will not comment on the meaning of the last sentence which is even more out there than the rest of your post. But I will at least correct you on the facts. There was an article in AD I believe that stated the number of Feyenoord players called by Louis during his tenures as national team coach and if I remember the article right, he called more players from Feyenoord than any other club in the Netherlands. As I said many times, you write whatever enters your mind. No fact checking, no attempt at perhaps thinking about what you are about to write before actually writing it…unfortunately for all of us, the answer is clearly NO. You talk about conspiracies, the religion of Danjuma (really???) and the marketing strategy of the national team which is of course to promote Ajax (when the article from AD stated exactly the opposite ie that Louis is really good for Feyenoord!!). All these statements without a shred of evidence but because you write it, some, at least on this blog, believe it. “The bigger the lie, the more people believe it” as Goebbels. Unfortunately, this is one thing he had correctly analyzed. People want to believe non sense, as somehow it makes then feel like there is order in the world, evnein the Dutch national team! The internet is a perfect vehicle to propagate all sorts of lies. So please for our sake, check and think before you write.

  48. @ Jeff

    when I was writing that piece, I knew it will drag you out from the hole so I did my homework and had this ready. I knew you will comment on this.

    Van Gaal calling up more feyenoord players than ajax has nothing to do what I said. I said that Ajax players are always at the forefront come selection and that’s how the systems works in Dutch football. Van Rijin, Veltman,Bazoer, Schuurs, (bench), Timber, Rensch. I’m not saying don’t call them up but it has to be legit and merit based and this is where the guns come out. Rensch selection, Timber at Make shift RB over karsdorp. veltman over van Dijk in 2014, Veltman over karsdorp , Blind over Buttner. Im not making this up, its all on the record. De Ligt and Frenkie were top notch and they deserved it.

    In generally, if you look at Gravenberch now, big hype around him, and in order to keep that hype around he has been fast tracked into NT. His stakes has to keep raising in the market regardless his form until such time he is sold and after that its he, himself and on his own and the NT doors will only open if , again a big question mark. whom you passed the baton at ajax, club over performance, coach preference , the same system cycling itself when someone leaves. veltman, tete??? Klaassen during his time was in the same boat (ice man, next bergkamp) and went through the same fate.

    look at VdBeek situation, just due to Frenkie and De ligt, he also became hyped up and now when the time to shift the gear, he is choking. his stats shows he has played considerable number of minutes last season but he simply cannot standout in the current United Midfield. is solskjaer deliberately not giving him minutes or has he proven in the minutes he has played, he is special and deserves to start or is cut above the rest. how can a players who was at his peak at ajax playing at CL level after changing clubs slip down to mediocre. everybody is pointing a finger at OGS but the fact remains he simply cant raise the bar above other midfielders. this will be fate of every Ajax players whether they make it or break it.

  49. @Derek

    Re:Part of Holland’s decline is part in due to just the relative size of the country. Sports have become a factory system, and the way you find gems now is to pump out as many players as possible and hope one of them is great. There are more footballers in the larger countries so of course (on average) they’ll develop more top top pros.

    At one hand, you claim the Netherlands is churning out players in a factory-like system. But in the same breath you assert that the country is too small to produce enough players to pick out quality from the bunch.

    Which is it? Both of your excuses can’t be true at the same time.

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