Tag: De Roon

by Jan

Oranje’s bright future…

It’s a bit cynical maybe to speak of a bright future after a loss in the Euro qualifications, but with Koeman’s 3-4-3 and the talents cherished by AZ, Feyenoord, PSV and …. Ajax (?), we should be able to mould a winning team again.

We will need to reach the Euros of course and that is not a certainty yet, but with the Greece game coming up and our escape route via the Nations League standings, it’s hard to believe we won’t be making it.

There have been some good suggestions on the blog for ideal pairings and such. I think it’s best to stay flexible also taking form and the strength of the opponent into consideration.

Goal Keepers

With Bijlow, Flekken, Verbruggen, Olij, Vaessen, Van Gassel, Gorter, Room, Noppert I don’t think we’ll have many issues here.

Bijlow remains my favorite, although Verbruggen will develop into a top goalie as well. If we have 3 goalies who can stop shots, distribute the ball, coach well and remain fit, I think we should be happy.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Central Trio

Van Dijk will be beyond criticism, as will Ake be. I think De Vrij will make way soon for Van der Ven/Botman. De Ligt is not ideal in this role as he will have trouble seconding for Dumfries/Frimpong as occasional “right back”. He’s not very agile and needs a direct opponent to bite himself into. I would see De Ligt as the replacement for Van Dijk. With space around the right centre back, the likes of Timber and Geertruida are more suited for that role on the right.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Van der Ven impressing in orange and in London

Wingbacks

It’s clear that Dumfries and Frimpong on the right and Hartmann, Malacia, Maatsen will be the main guys for the wingback role. I haven’t ruled Karsdorp out on the right, but he’ll need more playing time of course. Mitchell Bakker can be an option on the left and who knows, Wijndal?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Mercurial Frimpong

Central midfield

De Roon will probably always play a role in the squad as coach appreciate his physical strength, his tactical discipline and leadership but from a football perspective, Reinders, Wieffer and Veerman and even Schouten (PSV) will eclipse him at some point.

To me Schouten is a more complete “De Roon”. The PSV midfielder is also a great passer of the ball. Shame that he was overlooked, in particular with Koopmeiners out.

Frenkie will be a certainty. Koopmeiners/Frenkie hasn’t worked too well. Reinders could be a good partner for Frenkie. I personally rate him overall higher than Veerman who remains to be weak without the ball. Schouten/Frenkie can work well too, I believe.

Ryan Gravenberch is doing really in his early Liverpool days and he and Frenkie might also end up being a strong partnership. Not sure about Gravenberch as a 10. I can see Reijnders playing as a 10 though.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Jerdy Schouten

Forwards

Up front, it might get tough for Memphis to get back into the team, in particular if Koeman can get Brobby to perform. Gakpo and Xavi Simons are probably solid options for the coach. Noa Lang is on fire at PSV. A forward trio of Lang, Gakpo and Xavi Simons looks really amazing, with Malen, Bergwijn as support. Danjuma is a bit of a dark horse. No idea why he cut his time at Villareal short, as he was doing so well there and then he ended up with Everton??

Zirkzee and Joel Piroe might end up becoming top strikers for us too, in the years to come. Another forward/midfielder I really rate is Ruben van Bommel of AZ, currently in Jong Oranje.

In that squad, managed by Michael Reiziger, players like Kenneth Taylor, Jorrel Hato (Ajax defender), Dirk Proper (NEC) and Isaac Babadi (PSV) look like the real deal, as I’m also impressed with Noah Ohio (Standard Luik). The latter played his youth football in Manchester at United and City.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Ruben van Bommel scoring while Mark van Bommel is tearing up

Coaches and playing style

Ronald Koeman seems to have the sympathy factor in The Netherlands, based on his past as a player and based on his last stint as national team manager, as he is seen as the man who got Oranje out of the slumps. He’s not the most innovative or even adventurous coaches, but with Erwin Koeman next to him and more important, Sipke Hulshoff next to him, we should have all elements in place. Erwin is a great field coach and analyticus while Hulshoff offers the more modern coaching aspects to the team (stats, video analysis). Pat Lodewijks is always praised for his wonderful set piece ploys.

As clubs like PSV, Feyenoord, AZ but also Sparta and even Almere City transforming into high press, high octane teams (Ajax currently lacking behind a bit) and with top internationals playing this style of football already under Klopp, Guardiola and Xavi, it’s only a matter of time before Oranje plays in this same vein, forcing the likes of Xavi Simons, Memphis and Lang into the mould as well.

We will only get better.

The Greece game will not be easy. Greece is better than most people think ( we have a couple of these guys in the Eredivisie and they’re good). We can lose or draw that game, I would not be surprised.

We will still have a way into the Euros via the play offs but again: if we can’t beat Greece than we need to wonder what we want to achieve in those Euros.

Still, I say we win 0-2, with Weghorst and Simons on the score sheet.

by Jan

Naive Oranje humiliated in France

The number of times I had to write “boys v men” on this blog in the past decade is simply not funny anymore. Rafael van der Vaart compared our game v France with youth football.

This virus plagued Oranje got hammered by a lethal France and only have themselves to blame. Debutant Geertruida and youngster Xavi Simons are two of the players who scored a decent rating. Most of the others disappointed gravely in an avalanche of errors.

When Daley Blind is the cause for the only positive aspect of this game, you know we’re in trouble. Daley got his 100th cap for Oranje and joins the Oranje elite (behind Sneijder, Van der Sar, De Boer, Van der Vaart, Van Bronckhorst, Kuyt, Van Persie and Cocu and just in front of Robben).

In the 21st minute, when we’re trailing 3-0 against Les Blues, the stats tell the story: Holland has close to 70% possession of the ball. France has 3 shots on goal. Holland has 4 shots on goal. France has 3 goals. Oranje zero, nada, zilch.

We dominated the ball but France scored the goals. Deschamps gets the game he dreamed of, with The Netherlands gifting Coman, Kolo Muani and Mbappe all options to counter attack with their speed.

Koeman’s line up surprised a bit. Berghuis as winger/midfielder was a surprise to me, I expected Xavi Simons there. And I expected Malen, with his speed as well. I hoped for Wieffer but he wasn’t 100%, so Koeman decided against him and picked Taylor. Gravenberch was added to the squad late, after Veerman had to depart due to the gastro virus, but Taylor had more games at Ajax. De Roon was an obvious choice. But to play Geertruida and Timber “against type” was another surprise.

Oranje’s 70% possession didn’t do much for us. Why, because the French coach had a good idea which Dutch player to allow the ball. Griezmann covers Taylor (like he used to do on Frenkie) and De Roon is the man in midfield allowed to build up. Not his strength.

Another remarkable aspect: Koeman wants his full backs to remain wide and hugging the line. Ake on the left and Timber on the right usually play more inside as full backs (like Malacia at Man U and Geertruida at Feyenoord). Playing so wide means that the centre backs Geertruida and Van Dijk have difficulties reaching the wide man and regularly only see De Roon as their outlet. Again, not the man where you want the build up to start.

And this happened under Koeman I as well: the moment De Roon is played in, the French midfielders pounce hoping for a mistake. And this is exactly what happens in the first 90 seconds when Holland is patiently kicking the ball around.

The ball is on the right flank. Taylor omits to look over his shoulder, he only sees the ball. He is played in and is totally obliviousto Griezmann making a go for the ball. He passes square to De Roon who is hijacked by Rabiot and two passes later it’s 1-0. Also check the video to see how Taylor jogs back instead of busting a lung to mark Griezmann who ended up scoring their first goal.

The second goal is also the result of an error. It’s Cillesen this time who should be able to just collect the ball from a free kick from the right. But the NEC goalie misjudges the ball and the leather bounces from his arm onto the oncoming Upamecano: 2-0. An error yes, but at least one that you can sympathise with. A number of attackers and defenders were jumping in front of Cillesen, obstructing his views. A mistake like this is easily made. But … not nice to be 2-0 down after 9 minutes.

The free kick, from where this goal came, was the result of another positional error by the team. As you can see below.

Van Dijk is trying to play the offside- Liverpool style. But Timber and Geertruida have other ideas, probably due to the speed of MBappe and Coman. The pass is good, towards Coman and Geertruida makes the foul.

This miscommunication is typical for a team that doesn’t show any unity in thinking and doing. The players are too busy with their own individual role and don’t seem to see the bigger picture.

The third goal is after we see a variant used by Koeman in his first period, with a holding mid (normally Frenkie) dropping deep next to the central defenders to start the build up. This used to work, with powerhouse Dumfries high up the right channel. With Timber, it’s less logical. The Ajax central defender is best in the axis of the field. Why Koeman switched Geertruida and Timber is anyone’s guess.

This is just before the goal. Geertruida carries the ball. De Roon takes Timber’s spot. No one in midfield is open, so Geertruida is looking for Timber who is free. But the pass lacks pace, Hernandez read it well and sprints full swing to intercept the ball. In terms of numbers, this should not be a problem, as we have De Roon, Geertruida, Van Dijk and Ake in the defensive organisation while Taylor is also behind the ball. But still we get in trouble, as the players are not ideally positioned and Taylor does not coach his team mates like for instance De Roon or De Jong do in Oranje, or Kokcu at Feyenoord. So no one puts pressure on Tchouameni, the task of Wijnaldum. And when MBappe is at full speed, it’s De Roon who needs to track back, not something he does well. De Roon also lacks the speed needed. Muani lets the ball run and Mbappe gobbles it up: 3-0.

Koeman then switches Timber and Geertruida back to their usual positions and brings Weghorst for the disappointing Taylor, to spice things up a bit. It’s a bit too little too late, as France knows the match is won and they do take their foot off the gas. Therefore, it’s hard to judge the eleven that play the remainder of the game for us.

The game ends with another amateuristic error: a risky pass forward by Van Dijk, miscontrol by Memphis and he seems to pay the perfect assist to his friend MBappe who scores a superb 4-0.

Memphis missing a late penalty for Oranje is typical for the teams performance, on a night when everything we do fails.

Holland doesn’t have the calibre players that France have. As the saying goes: the better team will win against the better individuals. Sadly, Holland also doesn’t have the better team…

 

by Jan

Argentina is easy to beat

Allow me to start with apologising to all of you for the ongoing drivel about Berghuis and Blind. I keep on saying I won’t be baited and still it happens. I will let the opinions be for what they are. I am a fan of both players, as is now well-known and I simply can’t understand why Bergwijn, Taylor, Janssen or Klaassen don’t get the same amount of vomit from some here, it seems a focused attack on these two guys. I know they’re no Roberto Carlos or Fernando Redondo but they are among the best we have and when they wear orange, I support them. Like I support Weghorst, or De Roon. Enough said. I’ll behave from now on.

Feyenoord coach Arne Slot is currently considered the best and most exciting coach in the Eredivisie. His work at Cambuur and AZ has been applauded but his mission to coach a new Feyenoord team to a European finals has definitely put him solidly on the map as the new crown prince of Dutch football (yes, we tend to use that term for new exciting coaches… most of them start to fail once they got that moniker). This year, Slot had to replace 8 starters in his team and despite a short pre-season with shifts in his squad, he ended the first season half ( a third really) on top!

Feyenoord coach Arne Slot

As a guest at the NOS Studio WC 2022, he made some interesting points about Oranje and the chances.

About Van Gaal’s choices.

“It’s normal for a coach not to explain in detail why he does things. Everything van Gaal does or says has a reason behind it, this is how I know him. Even him joking about becoming the new NT manager for Belgium is to deflect attention away from the team and put the spotlight on him. He will always defend his players towards the outside world. Internally, he can be and will be really vocal and direct and super honest. I think he started with the players he started with, partly because some of them came in with fitness issues. All the focus went to Memphis, but De Ligt, De Roon, De Vrij, Lang and even Frenkie had had issues with injuries. Blind, Klaassen and Berghuis missed a number of games at Ajax due to different reasons as well. Van Gaal used the group games to get his full squad match fit. The reason for him to bring De Roon and Klaassen in versus Qatar had to do with this, I believe. He could have left these players out, but that would mean they would even drift further apart from fitness, which could hurt the team in the knock-out stages. Managing squad fitness and squad happiness – as I call it – is a key factor for a coach, but it hardly gets attention. The reason: coaches don’t want to let other teams know that there might be fitness issues and secondly, most people have no idea what it means to train a player “up” as we call it. It’s a science. Talking about the issues of the individual is also something that goes against the privacy codes. Imagine Van Gaal discussing the health of De Vrij while his management is negotiating with Tottenham Hotspur. It’s a tricky thing.”

About Argentina:

“I am a huge Messi fan. In club games, he never disappointed. He will always do something that makes your mouth fall open. And if Messi is in top form, he will be a problem for Holland… For any opponent. But the thing is, the other 10 players are not of his level. Some of them are actually not that good. Most of them have no clue what to do with the time and space around them. When a team press them high, there will be space in their defence for Messi to have a go at. He can hurt you then. He only needs one or two moments to score. But if you stay compact, the other guys won’t have the creativity to find him. If you lock him in, he will not get much joy and their defence has trouble defending bigger spaces. I expect a similar game as against the US. Hopefully with Oranje better in possession of course. Australia at times had the ball for two full minutes in a row. Against Argentina! Because they are not good without the ball. And when they try and press, the pitch becomes big and we can play easily in between the lines. If we play and execute the Van Gaal plan well, we will not have a lot of problems and will win that game. One condition, our rest-defence needs to be solid. Because once you lose the ball in attack, they will look up and spot Messi, who usually has wondered to some area where he is unmarked and he will pounce. If we organise our defence well, and so far we did, we will win. This Argentina is not like the Barcelona of a couple of years back.”

Van Dijk afraid to go into aerial duel 🙂

VI’s Pieter de Zwart – master analyst – on Oranje. “Despite the fact that Van Gaal’s Oranje is performing below par, the defence of the team excels. Even the wingbacks have finally gotten the headlights now, in the USA game. Let’s focus on the last line of defence.

The 2014 Argentina game is a big blot on Van Gaal’s resume. As he sees it: Oranje should have won as we were the better team (according to Louis The Sun King). And this is also why penalties are getting all that focus, with Frans Hoek – keeper trainer and guru and even with scientific approaches. They have developed so-called action types, with very technical terms like horizontal players and vertical players. Some penalty takers go for an angle. Others go for power. Others wait for the keeper to make a move. How to spot the types and what to do against them, was the main topic. By the way, De Ligt and Malacia have leaked who the penalty killer of Oranje is. In a game called 30 seconds, the question Malacia got from De Ligt was: Penalty killer? and Malacia answered: Noppert. And then both: OOPS!!

In 2014, Oranje played with a make-shift defence: an attacker who played in Turkey (Kuyt), two young Eredivisie defenders ( De Vrij, Martins Indi), an older defender playing relegation football in England (Vlaar) and a midfielder (Blind). Today, we have three top central defenders, an experienced left back and a marauding right wing back.

The Three Stooges: Sleepy, Narcy and Grumpy

In Qatar, Oranje is one of six nations who only conceded one goal. Ecuador’s goal was actually the first chance we gave away. The Dutch NT is on par with the strong nations, at this World Cup.

Our defenders all play a specific role.

Denzel Dumfries

Johan Cruyff, Rob Rensenbrink and Denzel Dumfries. A nice list of names. All Dutch players involved with 3 goals in 1 match. When asked about Dumfries’ performance against the US, Van Gaal quipped: “I gave him a kiss, the other day. But as there are cameras present now, I will do it again!” And Van Gaal bent over to the Inter defender, sitting next to him, and smacked a big pucker on Denzel’s cheek. “Thank you sir” was Denzel’s response. In the group games, Dumfries played disappointing matches, because the opponents were waiting for him in the zone, blocking his marauding runs. Then, his weaknesses become apparent. Hard feet and lack of real skills. He is the Dutch international with the most losses of possession. By far. Against the USA, he plays against Pulisic who is not the most driven defender and Denzel can bomb forward. And where the former Sparta player used to blindly hit the ball towards the area, now he picks his head up and sees the free runner.

Jurrien Timber

The only defender who didn’t start every match. Van Gaal calls the position, central back, as the right central defender needs to cover for the missing Dumfries a lot. A role better suited to Timber, as De Ligt also claims. Timber feels fine, in that role. As he also is comfortable in midfield, with or without the ball. With Blind, he repossesses the ball the most times (8 times) and like Ake he has not been dribbled past at all this World Cup. In the attacking sense, Van Gaal is not happy with Timber, as none of his forward passes to the final third ended up at the feet of a team mate. Against Ecuador, it’s partly his doodling on the ball that resulted in the equaliser.”

Virgil van Dijk

The more you don’t notice Van Dijk, the better it is. Van Gaal calls him “the General Forward Press”. When Virgil manages his troops well, he doesn’t have to do much. This is different from his role at Liverpool and it took him some time to get used to. Initially, Virgil was uncertain in the five-at-the-back system but he has grown into it. Against Senegal and Ecuador, he is too static and passive, and he gets quite some criticism from the pundits in Holland. Against Qatar and the USA he has picked it up and plays more forward passes. This is the Fabinho role at Liverpool basically. His heading capabilities are golden for Oranje.

Nathan Ake

Ake is the revelation for Oranje this World Cup, playing consistent, focused and with confidence. Ake always finds a solution and always finds a player in an orange jersey. He seems to be continuously in control of the situation. All the lessons learned from Van Gaal’s former captain at Man City. Guardiola teaches his defenders to keep the ball and dribble in until an opponent bites and makes a move towards the ball. Then Ake passes, as another Oranje player will have time and space. Against the USA, he breaks through the lines with 10 passes! He is top in number of forward passes and he has the least loss of possession. Only twice against the USA, whereas the number two and three on the list lost possession five times (Van Dijk and De Roon). Ake has surpassed De Vrij and De Ligt in this system, quite a feat. In a four man defence, he would only be able to play left back as Van Dijk is beyond reproach for Van Gaal.

Daley Blind

In the run up to the World Cup, Van Gaal says it’s unbelievable that Blind gets so much criticism at Ajax. The team manager doesn’t look at what Blind can not do, but focuses on what he can do. Against the USA, Blind’s strengths are exploited to the max. On paper, you’d expect a mismatch between the leggy Blind and the fast Weah, so Van Gaal instructs Ake to take care of Weah and pushes Blind up to deal with Dest. Blind ends the game with the most tackles (7) and the most duels won (9).

Blind also offers his attacking threat, with a goal and an assist. Against the first opponent who dare to attack Oranje, the wingbacks appear to become our biggest threats moving forward. Van Gaal was proud like a peacock. Blind had 60 forward passes into the opponent’s defensive third, with Frenkie (43) and Gakpo (35) as second and third.

Van Gaal believes Argentina might play the same way as the USA, with Messi in the Pulisic role. If they do, he believes Oranje will have good chances to win.

I say: 3-0, with Memphis, Gakpo and Blind on the score board.

by Jan

On the road to the semis: Frenkie will come good

Frenkie was the first to admit he didn’t play well against the USA. But he’s quite confident he will be present versus Argentina. Frenkie discusses some topics, and believes the Dutch were always happy to reach the finals. For him, it ain’t enough.

The Best

“I was a fan from a young age. I had posters of him on my wall, I adored him as a player. And it was just amazing to be able to play with him, a dream come true. He is the best in everything. In positioning, in ball handling, in his passing, his finishing. He sees everything a couple of seconds earlier. And you know it, but still he surprised me so often, at training or in the match. It was a privilege to play with him and now also to play against him. I mean, playing Argentina at a World Cup, it doesn’t get better. We didn’t app each other no. I won’t either, and I don’t think he will. We’ll see each other at the stadium and we might have a quick word there. And if not it’s fine too.”

Dominating

“Everyone wants to know how we will stop Messi but it’s not about him, but about Argentina. I don’t know what would work best: sacrifice a player or just deal with him as a team. We need to dominate and play better than them and mind you, he’s not the only player in the team. In La Liga, all teams were trying to stop him and tried so many things, but he will always bind 2 or 3 players and he will always have one or two things he can do, whatever you are doing.”

The System

“I wasn’t good against America, but it’s not system related. I simply wasn’t top, physically. Dealing with the aftermath of a cold. We play this system for some time now and I have done ok in it. I am still playing at the same spot and I get to play a lot of balls and get a lot of touches, so for me it’s not even that different. We haven’t lost in 19 matches and we don’t concede much while we did play against some decent teams, like France, Belgium, Germany. We didn’t make the right choices in the first half against the USA but they only got one real chance in the first half, and that was a mistake from us.”

Naive

“I am a football fan, I want every team to play full on attack, but you always need to take form and the opponent into account. Our intention is to attack and dominate more but you need to make the right decisions. If you lose the ball and you are naive and want to keep 5 players before the ball, well, you will get in trouble. It’s that simple. You have to deal with what you have in front of you. It all starts with control and if you defend well, you will not lose so easily. By the way, our first goal versus America was not a counter goal, and it surely is one of the most beautiful goals of the tournament, in my view.”

Critics

“Did Van der Vaart say I must have preferred to stay in my hotel, after the first half against the USA? Hahaha, I didn’t hear that one. Well, yes. I was bad. It happens, sadly and we do hear the criticism and we need to deal with it. I mean, we have played better and we want to play better, but then again, we haven’t lost here yet and we’re in the quarter finals, so we can not be all that bad. And I prefer winning over playing beautiful.”

Running

“I don’t think I have to run more in this system. I do have to track my opponent, yes. With Barcelona, we are usually the stronger side, so the opponent needs to follow us, that is a big difference. We do need to keep the space compact so you don’t have to run that much. If not, you do run more. I think I made the most kilometers in the first half versus the USA, because we didn’t play well.”

Expectations

“I don’t think we will play better versus better opponents. I don’t think it works that way. Sure, there will be more space maybe, but to think that this will help us play better… we need to do the things right, we need to make the right decisions, stay focused and work hard. Offer options and recognise the opportunities. I think it’s normal for people that Brazil or France have more of the ball and if the USA has more of the ball, people don’t get it. But it was not because they were so good, it was because we didn’t manage to play our game.”

World Cup

“I love this tournament, because the whole planet is involved and all the people seem to be enjoying it, everywhere. It’s beyond club colours, and when you win, the whole nation is happy, whereas when Ajax wins, the Ajax supporters are happy. It’s a difference. I vividly remember the Oranje games at World Cups. Like the win over Brazil in 2010, or the match versus Argentina in 2014. How Mascherano had to do his utmost to stop Robben from scoring in the last minute, that sort of things.”

Praying

“I have considered to go with the praying group, who pray and meditate before the meals. I am not religious or anything, but it is a grounding thing and we have players from different religions, doing this. Memphis organises it, it’s a sort of gathering. You don’t need to be religious. The mood is great, and we really believe in ourselves. I have watched most games and there is not one team that really rises about the rest. Brazil played great games, but also some lesser games. This applies to all teams.”

Stress

“There is always some form of stress and I guess you need that too. It will be even more now, with those Argentina fans in the stadium, but every player enjoys that. That is stress you need in a way. The one I found tough to deal with, was the decider against Norway, at home. In front of an empty stadium due to Covid. That was eerie. And we needed to get a result as well. We could lose something there, while now, we can only win something: a place in the semi finals.”

The Title

“We really want it now. We have the team for it, we believe in it. We also haven’t lost a match for some time now and it’s only 3 more games, hahaha. It’s that simple, right? But seriously, we will be completely bummed if we don’t win. In the past, we were so happy to reach the finals, it felt like we reached something. We don’t believe this. Reaching the finals is a means to an end. Which is finally winning the whole thing.”

by Jan

How to stop Messi: Ron Vlaar

People still stop Ron Vlaar at the super market to ask him about his match, 8 years ago, versus Argentina and Messi. This will only become more the case in the coming days. Not many defenders can say that they silenced the little maestro. And that was all at the biggest platform: the World Cup. The AZ youth coach explains how.

So how do you prep for a match up with Messi?

“You don’t. You should prepare for a game versus Argentina. And that was then and it’s the same now. You do need to take into account his particular skill set and quality, but you need to anticipate as a team, on them as a team. But a team with Messi. I just told myself, that whenever Messi would be in my neck of the woods, I had to stop him.”

So it was a team task?

“Yes of course. No one was sacrificed to play or mark him. It’s important that you constantly watch him and check his movements, in particular when we have the ball. Those are the moments he is waiting for. He’ll drift, he’ll wander, he will go to the spaces inbetween, mostly strolling almost. You saw it versus Australia as well. And his team mates will know where he is, and when they get possession back, like a snake they’ll find him fast. Half a ball is enough for him to punish you really. So that is where we need to be sharp. And I think we did well, in 2014.”

So how important was blocking the pass lines to Messi?

“They play the exact same way now as they played in 2014. Find Messi and give him the ball. It was very visible this way versus the Aussies this time around. They were sloppy in the first half, so they didn’t really find him, but in the second half they did, and Messi was immediately threatening.”

How do you look back at those personal duels?

“People still ask me about this. And I think there are some cool photos from that match. I personally don’t remember the match as me versus him. I fought duels with a lot of players in that game but these duels are less important to the fans I guess. For me, the whole performance was important, the team performance. At the end of the day, you need to do your job as a defender, no matter who the opponent.”

But Messi’s feet are a tad quicker than the average other player..

“That is true which is why you need to be ready for him before he gets the ball. If you can anticipate his runs, you have a chance. If you react to him, you’re usually too late already. You have to scan constantly. You need to take into account what is happening and what can happen. Because if you allow him to turn and then run at you, you’re toast. He has speed, ball skills, he can go left, right. The key things are anticipating and reading the situation. The good thing is, Frenkie and De Roon have the tendency to constantly look around them, all the time. They should be ready for him.”

And the forward press is key too?

“Super important, because Messi loves to drop deep to find space and make his runs. You need to be compact. And you need to pressure him from two angles. Close in on him. Ake and Timber are very good in the press and that will be a major asset. I played in the Virgil role back then and my role is the same as Virgil’s: to be there when he slips through the cracks.”

And than there is the role of the holding mid.

“Yes, that was something Nigel de Jong did for us in that semi final and he had to leave the pitch for an hour or so. He had to be subbed and Jordy Clasie did his job as a sub, which he did ever so well. That was such an important performance, as Clasie hadn’t played a single minute. In this Oranje, I think De Roon will be key, for when Frenkie is on his bike. Don’t forget, Dumfries is also usually gone.”

Which Argentina is better you think, the 2014 team or the current team?

“I think the Brazil one was bnetter. They had a younger Messi, a younger Di Maria, Higuain, Aguero, Mascherano, really top players. And more individual qualities. But, just like then, this Argentina does play as a team.”

Are you confident for the game?

“Yes, I think Holland is actually better. We don’t play flash, but we play very business like. To win. I loke that. And if the play with the ball is not good, they still perform their tasks without the ball. This team is hard to beat. And we have players who can make a difference. I too enjoy good football, but winning is more important to me. I don’t care how. It’s not about how good you are, but are you good enough to win. And this Oranje is good enough to win.”

While we’re talking, I can see Messi make his way up to the training pitch at Doha!

“Haha, cool! Tell him I said hi!”